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Khaines

Condor statement on Liberation berthing incident.

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Strange to see this described as a "berthing incident" though - when I first saw the thread I assumed it was to do with the earlier altercation between ConLib and the Guernsey pier.

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Brought out all the Condor bashers elsewhere I see - not surprised, been nothing to moan about recently so they are making up for lost time! So, if the Princess did not move and the Liberation hit her what would people be saying then? I'm getting muddled up with all the usual mud been thrown - did the Princess actually leave the berth to let the Liberation in, and Condor asked her to give them more room - or did she refuse to leave the berth completely? So much anti Condor mud being thrown getting lost in the usual bearpit finding it difficult to separate the wheat from what is mostly chaff!! I myself am looking forward to another trip now the school hols are almost over!!

Edited by Khaines

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I'm getting muddled up with all the usual mud been thrown - did the Princess actually leave the berth to let the Liberation in, and Condor asked her to give them more room - or did she refuse to leave the berth completely?

 

She moved twice, once from the western ro-ro berth to one of the freight berths to allow Liberation and Commodore Clipper in at the same time and then from that berth to another freight berth at Guernsey Harbours request to give Liberation more room to manoeuvre. Then as per Guernsey Harbours statement "on the Liberation’s arrival, the wind was North West at 22-28knts gusting over, which is at the upper operating limit for the vessel to berth in St Peter Port" so the Master decided not to dock and continue on to Poole.

 

Commodore Clipper managed to berth on the ro-ro berth originally vacated by the Hebridean Princess without incident.

 

If the much larger Clipper was able to dock and the ancient Hebridean Princess manage to manoeuvre round the Harbour it's not surprising people are questioning the suitability of the Liberation for service in to St Peter Port.

 

 

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28 knots is also quite low as an upper wind speed berthing limit for ConLib in St Peter Port - especially when that was specifically related to winds coming from the more sheltered westerly directions. Logically that means Force 5 would probably be about her limit for winds from the east! Not a wide weather window for a commercial service.

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Thanks for replies on that - easier to ask here than get my head bitten off in other places, get a more sensible and appropriate answer here. Wonder why, if the Clipper was able to dock - and she is bigger than the Liberation, then he latter needed more room? Perhaps her being an HSC? Condor are probably being cautious as well, as they don't really want the bad publicity of another prang. Liberation hitting the Princess - not to difficult to imagine who would come off worst. Whole situation is chaotic in Guernsey. As said, I'm just interested in getting the situation straight in my own mind. Thanks agan for replies.

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Hi There,

 

To avoid any potential confusion over the incident on Monday - you can read our statement here: http://www.condorferries.co.uk/news/

 

You can also see the layout plan of the Port on page 21 of the following: http://www.gov.gg/CHttpHandler.ashx?id=81041&p=0

Edited by Official_CondorFerries

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Official_CondorFerries you have just repeated the original press release, which contradicts what the Harbour master has said, so which statement is correct?

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If you consider the harbour layout together with the stated location of Hebridean Princess and the harbourmaster statement about the NW wind speed, what seems pretty clear is that the masters in command of Condor Liberation have no confidence that they can control her by keeping her away from a leeward berth or obstruction in a cross-wind. That's why she couldn't berth on berth 1 (no confidence they could stop her from being blown onto the berth whilst berthing), and they were worried that by berthing on the vacant windward berth 2 they would not have been able to stop her from being blown onto Hebridean Princess. In other words, in wind conditions above a Force 6 crosswind there is not enough power in Condor Liberation for them to be able to handle her with confidence. Probably all harks back to the earlier contact with berth 1 when berthing. Sorry to those who won't like this, but there is no other way of reconciling what Condor has had to say with the statement of the Guernsey harbourmaster.

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Rumours about that she has been "quietly" put up for sale on Guernsey Press comments on her..... Well, until an official statement says she is then take that with a pinch of salt. Another rumour is that Rapide will be doing UK - CI and Liberation will do CI to France, and taking that with a pinch of salt too until official statements say so, rumours are a pain in the backside. The autumn and winter are almost upon us so we'll find outvhow she copes, as said before, I have no qualms about going on her, not been on any ferries for the summer due to health, money and school hols reasons. So I'm looking forward to her again, same as Barf, no matter what the whingers say elsewhere. Got to be positive!! Hope she does cope ok with the next seasons!

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Rumours about that she has been "quietly" put up for sale on Guernsey Press comments on her..... Well, until an official statement says she is then take that with a pinch of salt. Another rumour is that Rapide will be doing UK - CI and Liberation will do CI to France, and taking that with a pinch of salt too until official statements say so, rumours are a pain in the backside. The autumn and winter are almost upon us so we'll find outvhow she copes, as said before, I have no qualms about going on her, not been on any ferries for the summer due to health, money and school hols reasons. So I'm looking forward to her again, same as Barf, no matter what the whingers say elsewhere. Got to be positive!! Hope she does cope ok with the next seasons!

 

I have heard rumours in St-Malo that Liberation may operate from there this winter, possibly taking some freight as well.

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That would make a lot of sense as the most prudent use of available resources over the low season months. UK to CI tended to be handled by only one of Express and Vitesse at any one time in any case, so Rapide should be able to cope fine in the winter. And with the St Malo service going mainly to St Helier (is that right?), ConLib would be able to minimise having to deal with the exposed confines of St Peter Port. (The berths at St Helier are a good deal more sheltered, and there is a bit more room at St Malo at most states of tide).

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Well,I'm sure it's not what they would consider the best option in an ideal world of being able to operate ConLib as they would wish, but it's a good way of making the best of a non-ideal situation. Takes the pressure off Lib having to berth in St Peter Port at particular times every day and enables her to organise her visits there to some extent according to wind conditions without completely screwing the customers.

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Well,I'm sure it's not what they would consider the best option in an ideal world of being able to operate ConLib as they would wish, but it's a good way of making the best of a non-ideal situation.
This is what I meant, if she is actually, more suited to that route in winter, then it would be probably a good idea. I would not want it to be for the reasons to shut those up who just want an Incat doing it. She is perfectly suited to the UK route and if this means she has to have extra room then so she should be given it. Others might be able to manage it, but so what - she is a powerful boat and she has already had one prang, doesn't need another one.

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Does anyone now think there is any hope that the Liberation will now have her wave height limit upped from 3.5 metres to 5 metres? I think she has testing on this with the MCA soon. I guess this may become an irrelevance though if she has issues with berthing in high winds. Despite all this I was very impressed with the onboard layout of the Liberation when I sailed on her for the first time 2 weeks ago -she also saved my travel plans in getting to the UK from Guernsey as I had been due to travel on Aurigny's jet that had been struck by lightening and was taken out of service, thus potentially threatening my travel plans.

 

Nick, Guernsey

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I know they were going to be testing her in the autumn - not exactly sure when. I have booked the main bow area seats as I like that bit of her, she is well laid out, the shop is very large, would say bigger than Barfleur. I need to get back out again so decided this week I'd book the ferries up, be nice to pop over to Guernsey, have a pub lunch and a couple of drinks . Have to take a longer day over - can't do much walking at the moment though which is what I like doing!

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Does anyone now think there is any hope that the Liberation will now have her wave height limit upped from 3.5 metres to 5 metres?

 

5 meters seriously? (sharp intake of breath)

 

Now that would be a white knuckle ride.

 

Crossing the channel in 5 meter seas on the Clipper is one thing but that would be some challenging experience on CL. Passenger comfort comes to mind.

 

 

 

 

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