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HONFLEUR - New Build for Ouistreham Route - CANCELLED


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That may well be the view being presented for now, but things can change. My point being that until the several thousand tons of hull sat floating actually have a decided future, I wouldn't 100% disco

I get the impression we've put more hours into this thread than the German shipyard have into the real ship. Ed. 

And don't forget that the ship's real achievement was the production of zero CO2 emissions, zero waste water and zero satisfied passengers for the whole of the 2019 summer season. Ed. 

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8 hours ago, hhvferry said:

There's a long line of satisfied FSG customers, from BC Ferries to UND to Cal Mac to DFDS. They'd need to get the old management and several of the key employees back before they tried anything new though and that talent may have long gone elsewhere.

True, but it depends on how ambitiously they pitch their products and if they aim for the smaller-sized vessels (which they have generally managed to make work - both as a business and once on the water) or if they persist in targeting more sophisticated orders.

They will need to start from scratch I suspect as I can't see the old management wanting to come back unless the yard gets partially nationalised to save it and they have job security.

Ed

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It appears that the German unions think that she will be finished elsewhere anywhere even the Congo 

https://www.ndr.de/nachrichten/schleswig-holstein/Muehsamer-Neustart-fuer-die-Flensburger-Werft,fsg370.html?fbclid=IwAR23x_vgnqTymFoagTZFLI8D2PKuFrL-cnUPUkFnYPNlpJmulC3cRcnBLDs


 

Works council angry - scrapping not excluded

Works council member Thomas Jansen is extremely upset about the rejection from Oslo. It is true that external companies have been busy with the equipment recently. Nevertheless, according to his information, around 80 FSG employees were also involved. However, further construction without a customer is considered problematic. Industry experts also consider scrapping to be possible. The previous FSG managing director Martin Hammer also becomes clear: "If the Siem company thinks it can finish the ship more cheaply in the Congo, then that is the case." He points out that the Siem companies are currently under financial pressure due to the general shipping crisis.

 

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Over the past few weeks, Brittany Ferries have been exploring all the options regarding 'Honfleur' and whether the ship could be completed at an alternative shipyard.

However, this morning, a BF source has told me that Brittany Ferries will definitely not be taking 'Honfleur'.

What happens to the ship now? Who knows. Maybe another company will take her on, but there is also a possibility that she will end up being scrapped. Such a shame! 

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9 minutes ago, TonyMWeaver said:

Over the past few weeks, Brittany Ferries have been exploring all the options regarding 'Honfleur' and whether the ship could be completed at an alternative shipyard.

However, this morning, a BF source has told me that Brittany Ferries will definitely not be taking 'Honfleur'.

What happens to the ship now? Who knows. Maybe another company will take her on, but there is also a possibility that she will end up being scrapped. Such a shame! 

It is a shame, and it begs the question what is BF fleet strategy for Ouistreham now?

Current options as I see them;

Do nothing - most likely given present economic situation.

One of the E Flexers - think Caen would need extensive modifications for them to fit.

New ship - could we see a variation of the E Flexer specially designed for the route.

New ship - another new design.

Cotentin - would it be possible? My fear would be a Pride of Burgundy style monstrosity.

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2 minutes ago, nick hall said:

It is a shame, and it begs the question what is BF fleet strategy for Ouistreham now?

 

Do nothing for the long run, I doubt they will plan another new build in the next 2 or 3 years. Cotentin will fit, but she's mainly freight and the idea of converting her was scrapped.

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15 minutes ago, TonyMWeaver said:

Do nothing for the long run, I doubt they will plan another new build in the next 2 or 3 years. Cotentin will fit, but she's mainly freight and the idea of converting her was scrapped.

Cotentin is scheduled for Cherbourg - Poole (Normaly). Nothing is likely to happen for a long time on the Ouistreham route. Normandie and Mont St Michel stay at home. Barfleur as a might well go to Le Havre unless STENA resumes the route in connection with a possible route creation to Ireland (Rosslare) =>

 https://www.irishtimes.com/news/ireland/irish-news/rosslare-port-in-talks-for-new-daily-direct-ferry-service-to-continental-europe-1.4372750 

https://www.independent.ie/regionals/goreyguardian/news/daily-ferry-to-france-needed-as-land-bridge-doomed-says-td-39570067.html

It should also be noted that the Pride-Of-Hull - Pride-Of-York will soon be on the market.

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46 minutes ago, TonyMWeaver said:

Normandie still has plenty of life left, just like Bretagne.

Very true, but if we are looking at 3 years before they even consider a new build, we're looking at what, seven years now maybe (assuming four years for development and build, and assuming a yard is available) looking at a 35 yr old Normandie. And that's ignoring that Bretagne and Barfleur* will also need replacing. That's a fairly big amount of ship renewal.

Not that I want to see the Normandie go!

* But that's a whole nother rabbit hole

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1 hour ago, TonyMWeaver said:

Normandie still has plenty of life left, just like Bretagne.

It's all subjective though - the business has had a major shock this year and whilst plans are in place, I think we're going to see even more of a focus on financial practices in the coming years. For travel and tourism, we still don't know what a recovery looks like or when it will materialise. Increasingly it feels like 2021 is going to be better than this year but also not 'normal'.

The combination of routes/ships will need to perform at a profitable level. There are 3 e-flexers on the way (one quite literally), Cotentin coming home and, let's face it, Honfleur should not be considered dead in the water until such time as it's sold elsewhere or scrapped.

On the broad assumption the newer tonnage is more economical* to run, then that could see changes the like of which we haven't seen or even considered in our wildly hypothetical minds before.

(* Not just in terms of fuel consumption, but also maintenance, staffing etc etc)

Edited by Jim
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1 hour ago, LHCity said:

Cotentin is scheduled for Cherbourg - Poole (Normaly). Nothing is likely to happen for a long time on the Ouistreham route. Normandie and Mont St Michel stay at home. Barfleur as a might well go to Le Havre unless STENA resumes the route in connection with a possible route creation to Ireland (Rosslare) =>

 https://www.irishtimes.com/news/ireland/irish-news/rosslare-port-in-talks-for-new-daily-direct-ferry-service-to-continental-europe-1.4372750 

https://www.independent.ie/regionals/goreyguardian/news/daily-ferry-to-france-needed-as-land-bridge-doomed-says-td-39570067.html

It should also be noted that the Pride-Of-Hull - Pride-Of-York will soon be on the market.

I presume you meant Pride of Bruges & Pride of York? 

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It is really up to Siem what they do & I am sure that they are pricing up the options, they don’t need a BF buy in at present.

If I was BF I would be discussing the option of a shorter eflexer with Stena, either as an additional ship or as a replacement for the third one.

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BF have never needed her anyway and just like the scrubber "investment" I've never understood why there was such a pressing desire to have her built and spend millions.

Put your hand up all those who were surprised when the announcement was made to replace Normandie rather than Bretagne?

 

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Has anyone any experience of the costs involved? E.g. what kind of typical annual maintenance costs would they budget for on Normandie and how much are they going up with age? At what point do you simply have to replace because reliability becomes such an issue, regardless of planned maintenance?

On the plus side for BF, at the moment they have a lot of spare ships lying around that could provide cover if Normandie became unreliable.  

Both P&O and Stena have in recent years undertaken life extension programmes on 30 - 40 year old vessels. Both Pride of York and Stena Europe haven't been entirely clear of problems since the works but they were obviously considered viable investments.

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