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3 hours ago, Danish Ferry Person said:

Did you take this with a drone? Which one? I'm thinking of the DJI spark! Amazing photo though LH :))!  

This is a photo from Le Havre Port Authority. The sam photo will be better with MV Normandie. :-))

Edited by LHCity
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On 09/09/2017 at 22:32, LHCity said:

ETRETAT at Le Havre Cross Channel Ferries

https://www.facebook.com/HaropaPortsdeParisSeineNormandie/?ref=br_rs

21314851_819560198213919_361481120864272[/img]

This very good photo illustrates rather well Le Havre's ferry berth.  I believe LD Lines wanted to use a Superfast at the start on their service to Portsmouth but this berth needed lengthening to take the ship which the Le Havre port authority declined to do for fear boat access to the pilot base would be obstructed.  I believe this is in the centre of the picture.  Thus LD had to abandon the idea.  I don't know if the berth has since been lengthened with further cylindrical piles but a Visentini is almost 20m shorter than a Superfast.

 

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35 minutes ago, Hawser Trunnion said:

This very good photo illustrates rather well Le Havre's ferry berth.  I believe LD Lines wanted to use a Superfast at the start on their service to Portsmouth but this berth needed lengthening to take the ship which the Le Havre port authority declined to do for fear boat access to the pilot base would be obstructed.  I believe this is in the centre of the picture.  Thus LD had to abandon the idea.  I don't know if the berth has since been lengthened with further cylindrical piles but a Visentini is almost 20m shorter than a Superfast.

 

Maybe HT but the Superfasts that LD were looking at were shorter than a Visentini, both the currently named Skania & Mega Express Four are 173m. Norman Leader (Nova Star) was to be shorter still at 161m. Baie de Seine is 200m give or take a few cms.

Who knows what's in the pipeline though as HAROPA has big plans for Le Havre & Rouen.

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13 minutes ago, jonno said:

Maybe HT but the Superfasts that LD were looking at were shorter than a Visentini, both the currently named Skania & Mega Express Four are 173m. Norman Leader (Nova Star) was to be shorter still at 161m. Baie de Seine is 200m give or take a few cms.

Who knows what's in the pipeline though as HAROPA has big plans for Le Havre & Rouen.

Are you sure about this?  I recall reading about it in "Lloyd's List" and the issue was the length of the Superfast and the Le Havre port authority's refusal to modify the berth.  I believe the vessel they had in mind later became SeaFrance Moliere.  

LD hoped to combine it with a smaller ship believing this to be the ideal combination.  This ferry is now Fjord Line's Oslofjord, massively rebuilt, and on Sandefjord-Stromstad but before that  at one stage was on Harwich-Cuxhaven for DFDS.  Unfortunately there were legal complications over this ship's charter status and so wasn't available.  

This is why I suggest LD weren't very lucky to start with.

 

 

 

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3 hours ago, Hawser Trunnion said:

Are you sure about this?  I recall reading about it in "Lloyd's List" and the issue was the length of the Superfast and the Le Havre port authority's refusal to modify the berth.  I believe the vessel they had in mind later became SeaFrance Moliere.  

LD hoped to combine it with a smaller ship believing this to be the ideal combination.  This ferry is now Fjord Line's Oslofjord, massively rebuilt, and on Sandefjord-Stromstad but before that  at one stage was on Harwich-Cuxhaven for DFDS.  Unfortunately there were legal complications over this ship's charter status and so wasn't available.  

This is why I suggest LD weren't very lucky to start with.

 

 

 

Superfast X sailed from the the berth to Marseille when Veolia bought her but aside from that she was unavailable back in 2005 when LD started up in Le Havre, she was on the Rosyth-Zeebrugge run SF didn't put her up for sale until mid 2006.

During 2005 Grimaldi were looking to replace the original Superfast I on their Barcelona run as after only 12 months they wanted something bigger but had to wait a further 2 years then eventually flogged her in 2008...LD were again in the hunt for Superfast II in 2006 before she was eventually sold to Corsica...They didn't do particularly well out of their merger did they, DFDS eventually got their hands on Transmanche & Norman Spirit?

I think LD were looking to strike the right balance between freight & passengers, maybe why they kept chopping & changing the Visentini's? It was a struggle 10-15 years ago although since HAROPA have taken over all of the port the future is a lot brighter.

Oslofjord is an interesting one... FjordLine sell her to DFDS only to buy her back and put her on the same route again.

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As HT suggests it was indeed one of the more modern Superfasts that LD were after, not one of the slightly more perfunctory first pair - I think VI before it went to Bimini. After the financial crisis all the Greek-owned Superfasts were for sale for the right price so they were certainly available, as were the Tallink ones at around the same time.

As for the Oslofjord - DFDS only ever chartered her, never bought her.

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2 hours ago, hhvferry said:

As HT suggests it was indeed one of the more modern Superfasts that LD were after, not one of the slightly more perfunctory first pair - I think VI before it went to Bimini. After the financial crisis all the Greek-owned Superfasts were for sale for the right price so they were certainly available, as were the Tallink ones at around the same time.

As for the Oslofjord - DFDS only ever chartered her, never bought her.

The Greek financial crisis wasn't until 2009 long after LD started Le Havre and SF VI wasn't sold to Bimini until 2013. Back in 2005 not even a Visentini could have moored at Le Havre as the berth ended at the end of the light blue outrigger. The two dolphins were added for LD's Norman Voyager.

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6 hours ago, jonno said:

The Greek financial crisis wasn't until 2009 long after LD started Le Havre and SF VI wasn't sold to Bimini until 2013. Back in 2005 not even a Visentini could have moored at Le Havre as the berth ended at the end of the light blue outrigger. The two dolphins were added for LD's Norman Voyager.

I don't think anyone believes LD planned to open the Le Havre route with a Superfast - it was how they were going to upgrade the route in lieu of the Norman Leader. The SF VI spent her final Superfast years running duplicate Ancona-Igoumenitsa-Patras sailings alongside Superfast XI and Hellenic Spirit on what was technically a two-ship service and was available for sale if anyone  stumped up the cash, which Genting finally did.

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9 hours ago, hhvferry said:

I don't think anyone believes LD planned to open the Le Havre route with a Superfast - it was how they were going to upgrade the route in lieu of the Norman Leader. The SF VI spent her final Superfast years running duplicate Ancona-Igoumenitsa-Patras sailings alongside Superfast XI and Hellenic Spirit on what was technically a two-ship service and was available for sale if anyone  stumped up the cash, which Genting finally did.

On 11/09/2017 at 13:28, jonno said:

Maybe HT but the Superfasts that LD were looking at were shorter than a Visentini, both the currently named Skania & Mega Express Four are 173m. Norman Leader (Nova Star) was to be shorter still at 161m. Baie de Seine is 200m give or take a few cms.

Who knows what's in the pipeline though as HAROPA has big plans for Le Havre & Rouen.

Are you sure about this?  I recall reading abp

My device is playing up again or is it the software somewhere regurgitating stuff I thought had posted!

I can't recall the vessel LD started with but certainly the idea of a Superfast for Ports-Le Havre came later.  It looks as if Le Havre have lengthened the berth by the addition of the white painted cylindrical piles seen in the photo.  Pity they couldn't have done this for LD whose subsequent history might have been different had they done so.

Certainly DFDS chartered the now Oslofjord and I seem to recall she was called Duchess of Scandinavia with them.  What defeated LD was the charter situation which was a question of charters and sub-charters.  The original owners were prepared to charter  to LD but the sub-charterers in between were not I seem to remember.

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LD started with Norman Spirit.  And it was a good start.  Until they started messing around and moved Norman Spirit to Boulogne (the start of what was to come with all their messing around), the whole LD project looked very promising.

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11 hours ago, hhvferry said:

I don't think anyone believes LD planned to open the Le Havre route with a Superfast - it was how they were going to upgrade the route in lieu of the Norman Leader. The SF VI spent her final Superfast years running duplicate Ancona-Igoumenitsa-Patras sailings alongside Superfast XI and Hellenic Spirit on what was technically a two-ship service and was available for sale if anyone  stumped up the cash, which Genting finally did.

Hhv I'm confused now, I've sailed on SF VI on that route a few times from as way back as 2003, I was always miffed as I missed out on SF XI every time. I didn't think ANEK had anything to do with Attica until 2011 before then Hellenic Spirit was competition and it was only after then that SF VI became surplus to requirements hence her sale in 2013?

I can understand why Tallink were attracted to VII, VIII & IX as I -VI have the lesser ice class certification although SF I had this upgraded when her stern was covered in Gdansk back in 2008 prior to her handover to Unity.

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1 hour ago, Hawser Trunnion said:

Are you sure about this?  I recall reading abp

My device is playing up again or is it the software somewhere regurgitating stuff I thought had posted!

I can't recall the vessel LD started with but certainly the idea of a Superfast for Ports-Le Havre came later.  It looks as if Le Havre have lengthened the berth by the addition of the white painted cylindrical piles seen in the photo.  Pity they couldn't have done this for LD whose subsequent history might have been different had they done so.

Certainly DFDS chartered the now Oslofjord and I seem to recall she was called Duchess of Scandinavia with them.  What defeated LD was the charter situation which was a question of charters and sub-charters.  The original owners were prepared to charter  to LD but the sub-charterers in between were not I seem to remember.

HT, I've been digging... Superfast X wasn't on the berth prior to her trip to Marseille that was my mistake.

The pile extensions were built by Le Havre to accommodate LD's chartered Norman Voyager and have a capacity of 205m hence the reason why BDS at 200m can berth. I wonder how put out they felt when LD gave her back just a year later?

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2 hours ago, jonno said:

I didn't think ANEK had anything to do with Attica until 2011 before then Hellenic Spirit was competition and it was only after then that SF VI became surplus to requirements hence her sale in 2013?

 

That's right - the period that LD were looking at her was after the ANEK/Superfast relationship began in 2011. At their peak Superfast's Ancona-Patra route used to have two sailings each way each day using four ships. That went down to three ships with odd-day additional sailings in 2009 when the Superfast XII moved to the Aegean and then down to two ships/one each way when the V was sold to BF after the '09 season. After the ANEK liaison began the spare sailings were back although the Minoan beasties were hoovering up traffic by that stage.

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13 hours ago, hhvferry said:

I don't think anyone believes LD planned to open the Le Havre route with a Superfast - it was how they were going to upgrade the route in lieu of the Norman Leader. The SF VI spent her final Superfast years running duplicate Ancona-Igoumenitsa-Patras sailings alongside Superfast XI and Hellenic Spirit on what was technically a two-ship service and was available for sale if anyone  stumped up the cash, which Genting finally did.

Timelines are slightly lost on me now but..
 
SUPERFAST X was looked at when SNCM had second thoughts about her and was only rejected due to the stated issues about the port of Le Havre. That must have been during 2007 at the point LD was having great success with the Le Havre route and a second ship was required. 
 
Eventually the NORMAN VOYAGER was secured and the rollercoaster of what followed of a ship arriving at the point the economy crashed has been well documented.
 
SUPERFAST VI was a serious possibility (2011 from memory) when the NORMAN LEADER was rejected but LDA Board insisted that the NORMAN SPIRIT had to be sold first/at same time and with TransEuropa dashing that hope the project never happened and in many respects was the beginning of the end of the Le Havre route.

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Re <<Eventually the NORMAN VOYAGER was secured and the rollercoaster of what followed of a ship arriving at the point the economy crashed has been well documented.>> 

The Etretat is the Norman Voyager with a new lick of paint. I use it a lot overnight from Portsmouth as you get longer in bed than on the Caen route & the car on deck 5 is easy to get to !

I recall P&O sailing out of Le Havre using the Pride of Portsmouth(https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MS_GNV_Atlas)  which was a big ship, in fact I was sailing in her when she dented  a new RN ship in Portsmouth in 2002

David

 

Edited by David Williams

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I’ve got the MAIB report into that little scrape somewhere.....an interesting read, as they all are.  Can’t remember exactly what the cause was now, I’ll have to go and refresh my memory!

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We heard a couple of days ago that Normandie had only one of her bow thrusters working correctly and needed help getting into Portsmouth under high winds. Reading this report it seems that one of PoP's thrusters was also out of action so maybe lessons have been learned and a standard procedure put in place when such mechanical problems coincide with high winds. Ed 

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