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Fleet Renewal - Second E-Flexer Confirmed

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6 minutes ago, neilcvx said:

I was aware that was the case with the Caen ships and Bretagnes funding has been documented on here before , will be intresting to see where a French built ship will go and who will own it.

She won't be built in France, the only yard which could do it is St Nazaire and they are fully booked with cruise ships until around 2026.

Navantia in Spain are busy working with both the U.S and Canadian Navies and LaNaval who are supposedly building the LNG powered 232 metre long monster for Balearia are seeking bankruptcy protection.

FSG could fit a build in for the end of 2021 or early 2022, we'll see.

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55 minutes ago, jonno said:

Apart from Cap Finistere and Normandie Express (I think?) none of the fleet are owned by Brittany Ferries hence for Bretagne we have SABEMEN:

SOCIÉTÉ ANONYM BRETONNE D'ÉCONOMIE MIXTE D'ÉQUIPEMENT NAVAL.

It was created in 1982 and has a capital of €83.4m.

That's been the most interesting part of the recent orders, since PEGASIS fell through and the securing Honfleur was rumoured to be delayed, I wonder if funding from the traditional French/Breton organisations has been trickier to come by/negotiate. That would certainly explain the turn towards a posh HP agreement from Stena.

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1 minute ago, SecretFerryEnthusiast1 said:

i just been speaking to the press office for Brittany ferries about possible movements of routes for pont aven and cap finistere and they said a decision will be made in the next couple of years but nothing will happen before 2021

 

 

When the new Stena ship arrives that would be pretty appropriate 😉

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I can see Bretagne surviving quite a few years yet on the Cork-Santander route if it proves successful. 

The problem remains St Malo...I suspect CF is not suitable, somewhat like PA. The best bet would be a slightly reworked Armorique moving to St Malo and Cap Finistère to Roscoff with the possibility of some Irish sailings too. 

I doubt Etretat and Connemara will survive long given the 5 year renewal programme in progress. The only possibility would be to add capacity to other routes.

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Much though I love Bretagne, she does need plumbing and other refit if she is to do another 5 years.

For Armorique, I suggested a while ago a Northlink Magnus Lounge option for waiter service, and raising the catering impression.

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16 hours ago, penguin said:

That's been the most interesting part of the recent orders, since PEGASIS fell through and the securing Honfleur was rumoured to be delayed, I wonder if funding from the traditional French/Breton organisations has been trickier to come by/negotiate. That would certainly explain the turn towards a posh HP agreement from Stena.

I can give you the nitty gritty of what it means but essentially BF don't own the vessels, they charter them all, the chambers of commerce are not particularly in it for profit but more for wholesale regional economic security. BF cannot cut services long term and have no real say when ships are bought, built or sold.

As we all know It was the local chamber of commerce and agricultural investment which started the company back in 1972.

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We will start to see how BF plan on moving ships around in next years timetable which should be out in July.

If Spanish demand is increasing and French demand is static we could well see some temporary cover by taking a ship from a French route when the BDS goes and I still have a feeling that Normandie will end up on a Spanish route for a while - notwithstanding it's age.

 

 

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1 hour ago, David Williams said:

We will start to see how BF plan on moving ships around in next years timetable which should be out in July.

If Spanish demand is increasing and French demand is static we could well see some temporary cover by taking a ship from a French route when the BDS goes and I still have a feeling that Normandie will end up on a Spanish route for a while - notwithstanding it's age.

 

 

The cover for BDS will probably be Etretat, the ship BF brought in originally for Spain, strategically they'll want her lane metres which are greater than the DFDS chartered vessel and her pax capacity also offers an slight increase too. 

Honfleur's reduced pax will, I believe, lead to the need of increasing the space on an alternate convenient route, Le Havre. Normandie offers this and maintains the same level of comfort and customer offer as Ouistreham.

BF don't have the final say where Normandie is deployed, that's ultimately up to SOMANOR, the local authority SPC who own her. It's the reason why I believe Pont Aven will remain on her current timetable.

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2 hours ago, jonno said:

BF don't have the final say where Normandie is deployed, that's ultimately up to SOMANOR, the local authority SPC who own her. It's the reason why I believe Pont Aven will remain on her current timetable.

Exactly. If the local Chambers of Commerce and tourism industry have a stake in the vessel's ownership then they are likely to lobby hard to keep her in their port to boost the attractiveness of the area and entice visitors. The fact that the vessel may be operating with a lower passenger load than she is capable of carrying might be of less worry than the prestige image the ship provides. Ed. 

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10 hours ago, jonno said:

Honfleur's reduced pax will, I believe, lead to the need of increasing the space on an alternate convenient route, Le Havre. Normandie offers this and maintains the same level of comfort and customer offer as Ouistreham.

 

According to Brittany Ferries' website, the HONFLEUR will have 257 cabins, compared with 220 on the NORMANDIE and 224 on the MONT ST MICHEL.  So, on night crossings, the HONFLEUR should be able to carry more.  Her daytime capacity is given as 1680 which is probably a more realistic figure than the 2000-odd for the present Caen ships.  How often do the MONT ST MICHEL or NORMANDIE carry over 1680 passengers ?

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38 minutes ago, GeoffHamer said:

According to Brittany Ferries' website, the HONFLEUR will have 257 cabins, compared with 220 on the NORMANDIE and 224 on the MONT ST MICHEL.  So, on night crossings, the HONFLEUR should be able to carry more.  Her daytime capacity is given as 1680 which is probably a more realistic figure than the 2000-odd for the present Caen ships.  How often do the MONT ST MICHEL or NORMANDIE carry over 1680 passengers ?

That's a fair point Geoff especially when you consider that MSM has only four more cabins than Normandie but has beds for fifty more passengers. It's then possibly fair to think that Honfleur will have an even greater ratio of four berths.

That may look good but on a night crossing it may reduce capacity depending on how many of these cabins only have two occupants. Not such a problem during the day when the ships make the majority of their money at sea where they spend 2/3 of their life.

Edited by jonno

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Per Westling the M.D. of Stena RoRO has confirmed the both E-Flexers will arrive in 2021. The second vessel (E.F.VI) will be bareboat chartered for 10 years and be fuelled by LNG.

Stena have two remaining options with the Chinese yard. So far three will head to the Irish Sea, (E.F. I, II, IV) two to BF ( E.F. III, VI.) and one to DFDS ( E.F. V.).

Without future civils work the only ports these ships can serve within the BF network are Portsmouth, Cherbourg, Santander and Bilbao.

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1 hour ago, neilcvx said:

 It’s interesting that the second ship is LNG and not the first , wonder what the reason for that is?

There's an LNG terminal in Zierbena, I wonder if the first ship will be used on the Santander run and the second is for Bilbao?

 

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On 30/05/2018 at 12:05, jonno said:

The cover for BDS will probably be Etretat, the ship BF brought in originally for Spain, strategically they'll want her lane metres which are greater than the DFDS chartered vessel and her pax capacity also offers an slight increase too. 

Honfleur's reduced pax will, I believe, lead to the need of increasing the space on an alternate convenient route, Le Havre. Normandie offers this and maintains the same level of comfort and customer offer as Ouistreham.

BF don't have the final say where Normandie is deployed, that's ultimately up to SOMANOR, the local authority SPC who own her. It's the reason why I believe Pont Aven will remain on her current timetable.

When I spoke to the press office they said there will be no changes for at least 2 years

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42 minutes ago, SecretFerryEnthusiast1 said:

When I spoke to the press office they said there will be no changes for at least 2 years

Baie de Seine is leaving the fleet next April, she's returning to DFDS 12 months early. Normandie is replacing Etretat at Le Havre next June when Honfleur arrives for Ouistreham. The E-Flexers are two years after that in 2021.

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22 minutes ago, jonno said:

Baie de Seine is leaving the fleet next April, she's returning to DFDS 12 months early. Normandie is replacing Etretat at Le Havre next June when Honfleur arrives for Ouistreham. The E-Flexers are two years after that in 2021.

Absolutely Jonno.  In the interim period, barring another charter, BF do not have any other option but to use Etretat to replace BDS I agree.  And even then there will be a gap between BDS going and Honfleur arriving.  Something will have to close down or run at reduced frequency in the interim.

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2 minutes ago, Gareth said:

And even then there will be a gap between BDS going and Honfleur arriving.

and that is why I think that they will use a ship from a French route in the mean time - Spain is increasing, France is static !

 

I also note that Normandie seems to be owned by Senecal which is a Calvados societie - I am not so sure that they would want to help Le Havre !

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