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jonno

New Dover Strait Tonnage for P&O.

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I would imagine that, as built for the Zeebrugge route, Pathway and Highway may have had cabins available for long-distance lorry drivers to have a bit of a kip?  If so, then presumably the Darwin conversion would have left these in place?

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I dont think there are any cabins on any of the Dover Calais specific built ships...would be a waste of freight space...............anyway the Bretagne is in far better condition than the floating Ronald McDonald emporium otherwise known as the Pride of Burgundy....

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19 minutes ago, Paully said:

I dont think there are any cabins on any of the Dover Calais specific built ships...would be a waste of freight space...............anyway the Bretagne is in far better condition than the floating Ronald McDonald emporium otherwise known as the Pride of Burgundy....

I wonder what their respective mileages are and how much they each cost.

Looking at the deck plans, the Darwins do seem to have retained cabins on their upper decks

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The Seaway still has the driver cabins forward (I think they're used for crew though?) where the Horizon/family lounge is now on the Darwins. They in turn had more crew/live on board cabins installed on the deck above the self service.

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11 hours ago, nick hall said:

Might well be that P&O move the Darwins to the North Channel in order to better compete with Stena.

Can't see it myself. I think they will both go to the beach. They are older and have had quite a hard life, after all.  There might be an argument for keeping Burgundy as the dedicated relief ship in lieu of European Seaway as she is more flexible and selling on the Seaway might actually be an easier proposition (if she is repaired first) .

Still three years until the new arrivals are here, so a lot could happen.  You would hope that the Zeebrugge route would have some news in that period - lets hope it's not going to be downgraded to freight only...

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1 hour ago, Gareth said:

Which Zeebrugge route are you referring to, VV?

Hull.

Personally, I think the pair are in reasonably good nick (I don't really think their age puts people off the route at all) but there have been a few technical issues. I just hope the route can carry on as a cruise ferry option.

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Ok thanks.  Just asking because it seemed to me that, once displaced from Calais, the Darwins (which will be virtually useless away from the Dover Straits) could usefully be used to revive a route to Zeebrugge from Dover (or maybe Ramsgate) to help cope with the anticipated congestion ahead.

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Can someone tell me why they are called Darwins? Have they evolved from some more basic design to what they look like today or were they used down in Australia at some point in the past? Thanks.  Ed. 

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21 minutes ago, Cabin-boy said:

Can someone tell me why they are called Darwins? Have they evolved from some more basic design to what they look like today or were they used down in Australia at some point in the past? Thanks.  Ed. 

As built they were European Highway and European Pathway, identical sisters to European Seaway.  The three of them operated P&O’s (formerly TT’s) Dover - Zeebrugge freight route.  The Highway and Pathway were converted into the passenger vessels they are today in the early 2000s, after P&O closed the Zeebrugge route down.

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9 minutes ago, Gareth said:

As built they were European Highway and European Pathway, identical sisters to European Seaway.  The three of them operated P&O’s (formerly TT’s) Dover - Zeebrugge freight route.  The Highway and Pathway were converted into the passenger vessels they are today in the early 2000s, after P&O closed the Zeebrugge route down.

Some interesting photos / history of the conversion on the attached!

Darwin was P&O's 'project name' for the conversion.

 

http://www.doverferryphotosforums.co.uk/mv-pride-of-canterbury-past-and-present/

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2 hours ago, Cabin-boy said:

Can someone tell me why they are called Darwins? Have they evolved from some more basic design to what they look like today or were they used down in Australia at some point in the past? Thanks.  Ed. 

Pride of Burgundy was a bit of a test bed - her design was changed while she was still in the yard so she never appeared as a freighter.  She's quite a bit smaller in terms of passenger space as a result.  

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Breaking news!!

Chinese media have started to surface the look of P&O Ferries upcoming giant! They talked about 2+1+1 ferries meaning P&O Ferries could lift just one of the option. The vessel will have space for 1600 passengers and 3600 Lane meters (I guess freight + cars). Funnel will almost be invisible while onboard passengers will enjoy a very lighty accomodation thank to the use of glass all around the passengers decks. Albeit being a double ended design space for freight will likely be king! What do you think?

Operator: P&O Ferries

Design: OSK

Shipyard: GSI, China

Where: Calais - Dover

When: 2023

Source: FerryVolution (September 27th 2019)

FB_IMG_1569621911960.jpg

FB_IMG_1569621916355.jpg

Edited by TonyMWeaver

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3 hours ago, TonyMWeaver said:

It doesn't matter what it looks like, if it does what it's designed to do, that's all that matters.

True but not true. In an age when your ship can appear in the background to a million social media posts it pays to make it not look like it's an ugly POS. Operators with high standards know that to make their ships look good is to make their brands look good.

It doesn't take much to employ a decent industrial designer to bring some order to a ship's external lines. Even when brought in late to the project they can have an impact - e.g. LD Lines asked Steen Friis to try and sort out the external lines of the Norman Leader/Nova Star and they had at least some impact in sorting out what was a bit of a mess when you compare initial renderings to final ship. When they are employed from the outset and can have a significant impact you have greater successes, like QE2 or, more relevantly, BF's Normandie.

Or P&O could have been fortunate to use consulting naval architects who would pay attention to the details themselves; not everyone can be a latter day Tage Wandborg but they could at least make an effort.

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Thankfully with the new Stena e-flexers, Color Hybrid, Honfleur, new Viking Line ship and Irish Ferries ships they still the need for some kind of visible bold funnel. These new P&O vessels look so weird and un-ship like without one.

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To be honest, and certainly on the P&O/TT side if not the Sealink/SNCF/DFDS side, the Dover-Calais ships stopped looking like ships (in any conventional sense) from the Blue Riband trio onwards.  This is just an evolution of the theme!

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 Yep a revolutionary sleek design from 1950s USA. Didn't last though as a concept though. The P&O ferries will hopefully have a very long future ahead of them even though they look like motorway service stations on sea or an airport terminal! A world a way from the maritime classics such as Maid of Kent where you would have thought you were really at sea. 

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