Timmy Posted October 28, 2018 Share Posted October 28, 2018 6 hours ago, Gareth said: That would be the only explanation! No it's not. The MAIB receive nearly two thousand accident reports a year, they don't all result in an investigation. If the incident isn't deemed serious enough to immediately begin an investigation then they will make a Preliminary Assessment to determine if further investigation is required and come to that decision within 2 weeks of the incident. If a company has already identified the issue, taken steps to prevent a re-occurrence to the MCA's satisfaction and its not considered that steps needs to be taken across the industry then you won't hear anything from the MAIB. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
bekkia Posted October 28, 2018 Share Posted October 28, 2018 2 hours ago, Timmy said: No it's not. The MAIB receive nearly two thousand accident reports a year, they don't all result in an investigation. If the incident isn't deemed serious enough to immediately begin an investigation then they will make a Preliminary Assessment to determine if further investigation is required and come to that decision within 2 weeks of the incident. If a company has already identified the issue, taken steps to prevent a re-occurrence to the MCA's satisfaction and its not considered that steps needs to be taken across the industry then you won't hear anything from the MAIB. Fair enough. Although you could argue that whatever steps were taken following the incident with Red Eagle weren't effective as proven by the 2 Red Falcon incidents which happened shortly afterwards (and in quick succession!). Whether this then merits reopening the Red Eagle investigation I do not know. Link to post Share on other sites
Aiden Posted October 28, 2018 Share Posted October 28, 2018 I have been told I can't say by who but it was not a equipment error if anyone thinks that Link to post Share on other sites
bekkia Posted October 28, 2018 Share Posted October 28, 2018 3 hours ago, Aiden said: I have been told I can't say by who but it was not a equipment error if anyone thinks that To be honest if equipment was even possibly to blame I doubt that Red Falcon would have been back in service within 24 hours. Link to post Share on other sites
Macc2010 Posted October 29, 2018 Author Share Posted October 29, 2018 What kind of hours do RF bridge teams work? i am asking as sometimes its down to working long hours and maybe they dont get the rest hours that they need. Link to post Share on other sites
Aiden Posted October 29, 2018 Share Posted October 29, 2018 14 hours ago, Macc2010 said: What kind of hours do RF bridge teams work? i am asking as sometimes its down to working long hours and maybe they dont get the rest hours that they need. It happened at about 8 a clock and they wouldn't of worked over night Link to post Share on other sites
David Williams Posted October 29, 2018 Share Posted October 29, 2018 The rules are https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/651841/MGN_564.pdf Note sure if it is covered or not as no damage was done. Link to post Share on other sites
scarlton Posted October 29, 2018 Share Posted October 29, 2018 (edited) On 27/10/2018 at 22:44, Gareth said: The criterion for triggering an investigation is singular - nothing to do with the seriousness of what happened or level of damage incurred. It is purely down to whether the incident was reported. If no-one reports it, the MAIB cannot investigate it. They cannot trigger investigations themselves just because they think an incident should be looked into. It's illegal to not report an incident. The MAIB has a huge amount of power. But they only have so many teams (3 or 5 I can't remember). The Chief Inspector determines what is to be investigated and what is not. I'd imagine with so many incidents in a short amount of time, they're spread thin. Edit: Just seen Timmy's reply. Didn't mean to parrot. Edited October 29, 2018 by scarlton 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Gareth Posted October 29, 2018 Share Posted October 29, 2018 And also, two similar incidents in close succession involving the same ship can presumably be rolled into being part of the same investigation? Link to post Share on other sites
captjack Posted October 29, 2018 Share Posted October 29, 2018 No, they would investigate as two separate incidents Link to post Share on other sites
Gareth Posted October 29, 2018 Share Posted October 29, 2018 Well....the earlier incident is not being investigated. So...either it has not been reported, or the MAIB has decided that an investigation is not warranted. Link to post Share on other sites
bekkia Posted October 30, 2018 Share Posted October 30, 2018 8 hours ago, Gareth said: Well....the earlier incident is not being investigated. So...either it has not been reported, or the MAIB has decided that an investigation is not warranted. It must have been reported. I guess it's been classed as not needing investigation although I'd be surprised if the investigations that are happening don't at least make reference to the earlier incident. Link to post Share on other sites
eagleeye Posted November 1, 2018 Share Posted November 1, 2018 Red falcon leaving for Falmouth shortly Link to post Share on other sites
spll Posted November 1, 2018 Share Posted November 1, 2018 (edited) Sorry did not Realise that Red Funnel had Three Accidents in such a short space of time, only the 2 being shown https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/marine-accident-investigation-branch-current-investigations/marine-accident-investigation-branch-current-investigations Edited November 1, 2018 by spll Link to post Share on other sites
bekkia Posted November 27, 2018 Share Posted November 27, 2018 It's foggy this morning and RF have suspended service on both car ferries and red jets. As far as I am aware Wightlink are still running. I haven't heard anything about Hovertravel. Link to post Share on other sites
cvabishop Posted November 27, 2018 Share Posted November 27, 2018 Wightlink are saying that both car ferry routes are delayed due to fog but that the foot ferries are running normally. Link to post Share on other sites
cvabishop Posted December 3, 2018 Share Posted December 3, 2018 Red Funnel take note.... https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/technology-46350188/the-ferry-using-rolls-royce-technology-that-sails-itself 1 Link to post Share on other sites
eagleeye Posted December 5, 2018 Share Posted December 5, 2018 https://www.iwcp.co.uk/news/17275629.red-funnel-captain-who-crashed-in-fog-thought-ferry-was-facing-the-other-way-leaked-report-reveals/. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Paully Posted December 5, 2018 Share Posted December 5, 2018 (edited) 2 hours ago, eagleeye said: https://www.iwcp.co.uk/news/17275629.red-funnel-captain-who-crashed-in-fog-thought-ferry-was-facing-the-other-way-leaked-report-reveals/. yet again another case of `pressonitis`..very prevelant in the aviation world sadly..you do wonder how much commercial pressure is placed on crews in todays world. With BF, though, you always have that feeling that the masters are left to make their own decisions regardless of cost..Long may that continue Edited December 5, 2018 by Paully Link to post Share on other sites
Millsy Posted December 5, 2018 Share Posted December 5, 2018 I don't think it's commercial pressure merely as you say the old 'my instruments must be wrong' syndrome well known for years in situations where disorientation occurs. Link to post Share on other sites
Paully Posted December 5, 2018 Share Posted December 5, 2018 Its pressure in the aviation industry all right, from top to bottom and often in subtle and insidious ways putting pressure on the Captain to maintain the schedule. I can`t believe there isnt an element of that in seaborne transport. Hopefully not and it was good old fashioned individual cock up. Link to post Share on other sites
Millsy Posted December 6, 2018 Share Posted December 6, 2018 I think that pressure's always been there in transportation really from the days when the railways ran punctuality leagues and such like Link to post Share on other sites
TonyMWeaver Posted March 28, 2019 Share Posted March 28, 2019 (edited) The official accident report from the 'Red Falcon' and Motor Cruiser 'Phoenix' from the MAIB is out. - Note that the Motor Cruiser was not carrying an AIS Transceiver and the skipper wasn't carrying a radio. Plus, he had very limited knowledge of COLREGS! https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/media/5c98e6b240f0b633fe11d2af/2019_-_4_-_Red_Falcon_and_Phoenix.pdf Edited March 28, 2019 by TonyMWeaver 1 Link to post Share on other sites
cvabishop Posted March 28, 2019 Share Posted March 28, 2019 The lack of knowledge of the motor boater (you can't call him a sailor) is pretty appalling given the length of time he had been constituting a floating Solent hazard! This sort of thing does seem to be more common with the speedboat people. They buy an expensive boat (with their unearned bonuses!) but cannot be bothered to learn to navigate safely, it's just point and shoot with a row of semi capsized yachts and other small craft in their wake. I've seen it so many times. I do hope his insurers refused to pay out as he was not keeping a proper lookout as he was required to. Presumably he was so used to speeding that the idea of anything coming up astern never entered his stupid head. 2 Link to post Share on other sites
Gareth Posted March 28, 2019 Share Posted March 28, 2019 Unfortunately it’s aided and abetted by the manufacturers of these gin palaces. People with more money than they know the meaning of turn up at the boatshow, and the Princess and Sunseeker reps tell them that driving one of these things is just like driving a car. So they hand over the cash and then park their new craft somewhere in the Solent. As Colin says, “sailor” is a totally inappropriate word. But still the RYA plugs away with its mantra of no need for regulation. Link to post Share on other sites
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