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Brexit effect on BF

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41 minutes ago, jonno said:

Again though none of the Irish Sea carriers are looking at any issues with the land bridge, just like the channel they are in the process of securing larger ships to transport more goods to the U.K west coast ports and beyond. 

Not one carrier effected by the referendum result has said "let's wait and see" if anything they've gone in completely the opposite direction. Stena have now purchased both Superfasts and will of course have the first three E-Flexers, Irish Ferries will have an even larger stablemate for Ulysses. They are expecting and gearing up for a greater demand for freight and passengers.

The same can be said for DFDS on the eastern channel plus P&O who are building larger RoPax' to partner the Spirits.

BF have increased crossings in the short term but the move to shift Normandie to Le Havre is about route expansion not U.K freight congestion and the introduction of Honfleur and the E-Flexer triplets for Spain is due to the same expectation.

We also have the positive news coming out of Rosyth which hopefully will give Scotland a dedicated European link and another option for us to enjoy.

It's not just the RoPax market either. RoRo's & ConRo's based at Felixstowe, Immingham, Teesport and Tilbury are getting busier with ongoing expansions to deal with larger numbers, Immingham for example is seeing a large amount of goods historically destined for the Dover crossings heading their way.

This is an indication not only of the Brexit effect on BF but the effect on all of the major players in sea borne freight which either transits the U.K or has it's origins there.

 

In the long term, there is little doubt that trade will continue to increase in all directions, a ship is for 30 years, businesses and public sector should adapt to cope within a year of any dramatic changes at the borders. In the short term, it's interesting that IF don't appear to think that the Roscoff route would make enough money out of any uncertainly or disruption to keep open for another year. If I were in their shoes, I'd be doing my best to convince hauliers their service is more reliable than the British Government.

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12 minutes ago, Gareth said:

One can certainly conclude that they have no plans to close down.

At least there is that one outcome that would on the face of it seem probable.

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1 hour ago, wortley said:

If B/F is struggling for passengers the company might need to look at its pricing structure.

My neighbour is taking car, Caravan and partner to France in May.  B/F was quoting him £420 return without cabins on Plymouth/Roscoff daytime crossings - so I offered him a 10% Friends and Family code to bring the price down to £378.  He smiled and showed me that the Caravan Club was offering him the same crossings on Armorique on the same dates for £280.  If an agent can sell those tickets for £280 ( and presumably show a profit on the deal ) then B/F own prices are too dear . 

That's quite a saving. What is the annual fee to join the caravan club? Maybe that's where they are making their profit. Ed. 

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https://www.plymouthherald.co.uk/news/business/brexit-brittany-ferries-blames-passengers-2747569

Well, in the case of Barfleur, they have done away with the daytrips without having to do an overnight crossing.  I don’t mind overnight crossings, but daytrips have always been popular with our friend in Poole especially, be nice to get them back.  BBC News has done a bulletin on the fall in numbers.  

Edited by Khaines

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3 hours ago, G4rth said:

Can one conclude that ferry companies are hell bent on expansion into and out of the UK just because they have ordered new ships? I would have thought that conclusion could only reasonably be arrived at if the arrival of newer more efficient ships result in new routes or increased frequency of sailings. It may coinside with the sale of older less efficient ones and less sailings on fewer routes but, as HT would say, only time will tell.

No your right G4rth, new ships doesn't necessarily equate to expansion...however It does when their capacities far outstrip the not very old tonnage they are replacing. There aren't enough hours in the day for both Stena & I.F to rotate their Irish sea fleets to the U.K. such is the demand. Neither can they add ships due to the ports and crossing times. Also Visentini's are modern and very fuel efficient, the latter being a major selling point and the reason they are so popular, not to mention that the Irish Sea has no MARPOL/SECA restrictions to tug on your purse strings.

Consider Irish Ferries conventional crossings to Holyhead, there are four a day. Currently you have Ulysses & Epsilon a total of 2338 passengers and around 6930 lane metres., next year when Epsilon is replaced that will jump to a total of 3738 passengers and 9680 lane metres. That's expansion.

Then there's Stena from Belfast, again the Visentini's are modern, efficient and have had a lot of money invested in them raising their standard to a far higher level than that of Etretat & Connemara. Currently 4480 lane metres and 1450 passengers, this will jump to 6100 lane metres for HGV's and further capacity for 600 cars, pax wise there's a combined jump to 2000. Again, that's expansion.

It's the same for BF, they are actually replacing a modern ship with one nearly 30 years old in order to increase capacity at Le Havre and the Spanish expansion needs no further discussion as informed opinion is that both Cap Finistere and Pont Aven will remain.

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11 hours ago, Cabin-boy said:

That's quite a saving. What is the annual fee to join the caravan club? Maybe that's where they are making their profit. Ed. 

It's £52. They've never quite managed to offer the same deals for their motorhome members... even though they've changed their name to include said machine in the clubs title... plus if you want something a little more elaborate, like a cabin for instance, the price rises a bit disproportionately. Over the years we and many others with MoHo's have found that CV membership offers far more of a saving on the overall cost of passage, cabin & meals.

As an example Ed, last December we toured a few Xmas markets in Holland, Germany & Belgium, it was a tour tailored for Caravan & Motorhome Club members. Their ferry price was higher than P&O's and didn't include breakfast which P&O offer as standard from Hull.

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On 17/04/2019 at 03:35, jonno said:

It's £52. They've never quite managed to offer the same deals for their motorhome members... even though they've changed their name to include said machine in the clubs title... plus if you want something a little more elaborate, like a cabin for instance, the price rises a bit disproportionately. Over the years we and many others with MoHo's have found that CV membership offers far more of a saving on the overall cost of passage, cabin & meals.

As an example Ed, last December we toured a few Xmas markets in Holland, Germany & Belgium, it was a tour tailored for Caravan & Motorhome Club members. Their ferry price was higher than P&O's and didn't include breakfast which P&O offer as standard from Hull.

A bit off topic - but we always book our caravan crossings with Caravan and Motorhome club. We tend to travel P&O Hull routes and the P&O price comes in at about £800. The CMC is always a little cheaper but if you then book three or four nights sites with them the price comes down by another £100 or so.  As we use the sites that we book with them it's an overall saving of about £300 

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Not a great deal I would imagine... BF will still have done well out of this, the majority of its sailing alterations have already occurred and (March 29 - now)... and there will be get out clauses which will have to be met by the government.

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The contracts will be clear as to how they get cancelled, I am sure that the summer sailings that have now been changed are part of the minimum term.

I note a quote in the article 

<<One ferry company told the broadcaster: “Since December, we have changed our schedules, added 20 weekly sailings, disrupted 30k passengers and hired more staff, all to be ready for what is now not needed.” >>

That sounds like BF who managed communications with Customers so badly. There are a number of tweets of people that bought non flexible accommodation who have been affected by the change. 

 

Edited by David Williams

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10 minutes ago, Cabin-boy said:

That's because you don't know the magic (pass)word. Ed. 😀 

Is it "Grayling" ?:)

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Very probably, or an anagram (don't worry Gareth, I'll keep it clean!) of his name. The best I can do at short notice is 'shy garlic grin' but there are certainly other better ones. Ed 

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As a new boy, can I suggest that BF use this spare capacity to nip in quick and resurrect the Irish-France (Rosslare to Roscoff) recently abandoned by Irish Ferries this year much to the disgust of all of us in the South East of the Emerald Isle. The new W B Yeats only sails from Dublin and is already getting stick for not being a proper cruise ferry and expensive to boot (dinner €59, breakfast €20 for either option, a croissant quoted at €5) 

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Effectively, that’s what they are doing.  Sending Armorique across to Cork in place of some of her excess Plymouth sailings.  BF has no interest in Rosslare, however.

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In other words. 

We’ve still got the tax payers money so we aren’t altering or cancelling the sailings.

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1 hour ago, BigDW1946 said:

As a new boy, can I suggest that BF use this spare capacity to nip in quick and resurrect the Irish-France (Rosslare to Roscoff) recently abandoned by Irish Ferries this year much to the disgust of all of us in the South East of the Emerald Isle. The new W B Yeats only sails from Dublin and is already getting stick for not being a proper cruise ferry and expensive to boot (dinner €59, breakfast €20 for either option, a croissant quoted at €5) 

BF have two offerings to Ireland now. 

Pont Aven "luxury cruise ferry" and the "economy" option Connemara. They both serve Cork admittedly, however I would guess that BF would be extremely cautious about expanding too much into Ireland... Irish ferries know their market, and from what I have seen personally on Roscoff-Cork sailings, unless it is peak season, demand is weak. I doubt they would go for much more at the moment. Just my opinion...

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4 hours ago, Gareth said:

The final irony will be if Seabourne Freight now commences operation! 🙄

Gareth, behave!

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A lot of anagrams have little or no real relevance to the source words as my above example proves. However, it being May-day and I'm not allowed to do any real work and everything is shut, I've spent the afternoon running the letters around my head. 

So, if Chris Grayling is knighted for his services to the British transport industry then his new title could be (and I think it is relevant): 'Sir Gangly Rich'. 😀 Ed. 

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2 hours ago, Cabin-boy said:

And the press in Plymouth isn't helping by using this type of headline. 

https://t.co/hfHR2LocOw

Ed

Oh dear, last time our commented on our excellent and honest press as above I got deleted by the Mods. So I wont say a thing. Oh God I just did. Silly me!

Stu

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