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http://UK to spend £108m on no-deal ferries http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-46704522

The BBC currently seem to be describing DFDS as Dutch in the article, a bit like their Swiss rivals Stena! This charter just raises so many political issues of course but  more importantly where will the available tonnage come from? Are the Government just paying for Pelican to work harder or will we see new tonnage?

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On 29/12/2018 at 06:42, Northy said:

Discuss!

UK to spend £108m on no-deal ferries http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-46704522

 

Further news tonight.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-46714984

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2018/dec/30/no-deal-brexit-ferry-company-owns-no-ships-and-has-never-run-ferry-service

 

 

Edited by G4rth

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This appeared on a Facebook post, obviously one cannot cast accusations, but looks very coincidental...

"Seabourne Freight shares the same registered Address, 59 Mansell Street, as the Maritime Law firm Camp,bell Johnson Clark whose Director is called Mark Bamford. I wonder if Mark could be related to Anthony Bamford of JCB, the largest Tory donor?"

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I must profess to a degree of confusion about all this.  I understand that if port turnround times for vessels go up then you need more ships to maintain a given route capacity.  But at what stage does the number of berths become the determinant of capacity rather than fleet size I(my history has involved line capacity analysis for metro railways). At the moment Dover has about 55 daily arrival/departure pairs spread over, I think, 7 linkspans, suggesting an average timetabled linkspan utilisation of about 8 per berth per day or every three hours, apparently comfortable if you're turning them round at a rate of once an hour.  But at what stage do you hit the capacity ceiling as berth layover times go up ? Is it 2-hour turnrounds ? 2.5 hours ?  How much slack in timetabled berth utilisation can you actually get away with ?  Commentary from those of you better qualified on these issues than I very much welcome.

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I think there’s a limit to the berths that the Spirits can use, so berth utilisation has to be planned around them coming in.

Berth 1 is single deck, would work for a freighter. Then there’s two pairs, Berths 2 & 3 and Berths 5 & 6 (berth 4 had a small linkspan removed decades ago, last used by the Ostend tubs), then Berth 7 sandwiched between Berths 8 & 9. Even in the pre tunnel days with ships to Boulogne, Calais, Dunkerque, Zeebrugge and Ostend it has never had so many.

But I think the issue isn’t about linkspans or even the capacity of the ships. It’s vast amount of traffic and the corresponding size of the ships that means that any delay getting trucks through customs is going to have an immediate and significant impact. A small initial delay could snowball fast.

What this won’t be doing is encouraging folks to go on self drive anywhere on the continent at least for the foreseeable; it’ll hit the likes of Eurocamp, Canvas etc hard plus probably Brittany Ferries’ holidays too as the majority public perception will be all the ferries will be backed up.

HM Government couldn’t make more of a mess of Brexit if they tried, thanks Theresa Omnishambles May.

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1 hour ago, Khaines said:

This appeared on a Facebook post, obviously one cannot cast accusations, but looks very coincidental...

"Seabourne Freight shares the same registered Address, 59 Mansell Street, as the Maritime Law firm Camp,bell Johnson Clark whose Director is called Mark Bamford. I wonder if Mark could be related to Anthony Bamford of JCB, the largest Tory donor?" 

No, they are completely separate people, as two minutes work on Companies House proves.

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Hello, long-time ferry user, first-time poster, drawn to this site by this discussion.

In answer to hhvferry's post, Anthony Bamford of JCB does have a brother called Mark.

 

I'm also intrigued about the legality of awarding contracts of this magnitude without going through proper procurement procedures, surely illegal under, um, EU regulations?

 

Edited by Millsy

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Please be careful about linking bits of disparate information. The plain fact is that whoever a particular Mark Bamford is or is not, and whoever he might or not be related to, he is not repeat not an officer of Seaborne Freight. Additionally just because firms share the same registered offices it does not mean that there is any other connection between them.

Furthermore as hvferry has pointed out a minutes work proves they are not one and the same. 

 

Edited by Millsy
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1 hour ago, Khaines said:

I checked stuff before, they are brothers.  I also googled “Mark and Antony Bamford” and yes they are connected.  An example as well.

https://companycheck.co.uk/company/01210689/JCB-SITEWEAR-LIMITED/companies-house-data

Yes no-one's disputing these two people are brothers. But there are more than two Mark Bamfords (Marks Bamford?).

The conspiracy theory is that the Mark Bamford at Campbell Johnston Clark is the brother of the Tory donor. He indisputably isn't. The CJC fellow is Mark Thomas Bamford, the brother of the Tory donor is Mark Joseph Cyril Bamford.

It's too easy to spread misinformation so we need to be careful when making outlandish claims.

Even if it were the same person the degrees of separation make it tenuous at best. 

Edited by hhvferry
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Well, we’ll say no more on it and see what pans out, if anything.  But in my opinion there is something VERY fishy about this award.  Why not P&O?

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Five years ago we were entertained on here by a gentleman called Ernst who promised faithfully to re open Ramsgate/Ostend, and gave us the memorable assurance,"I want to give Larkspur and Gardenia a few more years to live"  . Alas no one gave him £13.8 million and so they died. Happy New Year Ernst. 

Edited by wortley
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These guys have credibility and huge amounts of very relevant experience and were looking speculatively to start a service (I suspect they were waiting to see how Brexit went).

They may never start that service but just because there have been fantasists at Ramsgate before doesn't discredit them. They are not Ernst Munk.

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5 minutes ago, hhvferry said:

These guys have credibility and huge amounts of very relevant experience and were looking speculatively to start a service (I suspect they were waiting to see how Brexit went).

They may never start that service but just because there have been fantasists at Ramsgate before doesn't discredit them. They are not Ernst Munk.

Were these the people trying to open Ramsgate up as a ferry port again, how far did they get?  It would be logical to use Ramsgate to ease Dover and if they have done any serious groundwork it would be sensible to use them, if not it would look suspicious, could just be someone in the Dept of Transport read there publicity and said "they could be useful".

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Further to the previous post, there was a chap on the news who seemed to be campaigning to stop Ramsgate reopening, has he got local backing or just stirring things up?

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It would be surprising if the two Bamfords weren't related, if you go back 10 generations we have over 2000 people in our direct line of ancestors. Go back 20 generations and we have over a million. If you throw in uncles and aunts it is a massive number of relatives. I'm probably related in some way to everyone on this site, good news for me but probably not quite such good news for all of you. We may be related but that doesn't mean I'd do you or indeed my probably distant cousins the Bamfords any special favours.😉

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1 hour ago, hhvferry said:

These guys have credibility and huge amounts of very relevant experience and were looking speculatively to start a service (I suspect they were waiting to see how Brexit went).

They may never start that service but just because there have been fantasists at Ramsgate before doesn't discredit them. They are not Ernst Munk.

In fairness, if those guys are experienced, they would be far better placed to manage Brexit ferries over the government trying to start one from scratch. If all the  corporate structures are in place, with knowledgeable people at the helm who've already been planning the service, why reinvent the wheel?

Edited by penguin
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55 minutes ago, G4rth said:

We may be related but that doesn't mean I'd do you or indeed my probably distant cousins the Bamfords any special favours.

Don't take this the wrong way, but can I suggest a minor punctuation change to the above? 😀 

"We may be related but that doesn't mean I'd do you, or indeed my probably distant cousins the Bamfords, any special favours.

It may just be me, but I think it reads slightly better. Ed. 

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25 minutes ago, Cabin-boy said:

Don't take this the wrong way, but can I suggest a minor punctuation change to the above? 😀 

"We may be related but that doesn't mean I'd do you, or indeed my probably distant cousins the Bamfords, any special favours.

It may just be me, but I think it reads slightly better. Ed. 

Thank you distant cousin for your input. I think you're right, you have improved my post and for that I am grateful.

The above could probably do with some improvement as well if you have the time.

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