Jump to content
Sign in to follow this  
TonyMWeaver

Bretagne - 30 Years

Recommended Posts

3 hours ago, colin said:

There have been articles in Le Marin and Mer et Maritime saying that the Chantiers de l'Atlantique have sadly confirmed to BF that they cannot fit the construction of the new Bretagne into their schedule, even with subcontracting huge proportions of the job. The articles are subscriber access only, but seem to go on to give more info on the project and the desired delivery date. Anyone got access?

This is a blunt translation...

The successor to the ferry Brittany will not see the light of day at the Chantiers de l'Atlantique, from where his old elder was released in 1989. In Saint-Nazaire, it is indicated that it does not have the possibility to meet the wish of Brittany Ferries to realize this ship in the estuary of the Loire. In question, a load plan too full to allow to insert between two large steamers - even by subcontracting all or part of the hull - the future ferry Breton, which must join the fleet of the owner of Roscoff in 2022. Under these conditions, the company will have no choice but to have its boat built in a foreign yard, as is currently the case with Honfleur, at completion at FSG in Germany.

For the record, Chantiers de l'Atlantique is experiencing a new level of activity since the 1960s and 1970s. Following last week's delivery of the MSC Bellissima (F34), their backlog currently includes 10 cruise ships under firm contracts and at least another 4 in option. All are to be delivered by the end of 2026. In addition there is the recent notification of the four future naval supply ships (BRF) of the French Navy, which will come out of the Nazi shipyards in 2023, 2025, 2027 and 2029. The French manufacturer The company, which is working on other projects, is also waiting for orders from several electrical substations for offshore wind farms.

Such activity prevents the site, despite the optimization of its industrial tool and even the increase of its capacity with the extension of the pre-assembly area, to accept new large vessels for short-term deliveries. Without being able to take the "Brittany 2", Saint-Nazaire unfortunately missed a great opportunity to revive the ferries market, where his last production dates back to Berlioz, delivered to the defunct SeaFrance in 2005. The Chantiers from the Atlantic had then worked with Brittany Ferries to develop a large ferry, which would have been the first French ship equipped with a propulsion operating on liquefied natural gas. It was the Pegasis project, which the Breton shipowner was forced to abandon in 2014 for lack of funding. The same year, Saint-Nazaire had no more luck with the project of LNG vessels carried by the former SNCM, the company was liquidated before being able to launch its modernization program. Then the orders of ships have returned in force, until saturate the industrial tool for many years. This is excellent news for Chantiers de l'Atlantique, which is in danger of disappearing in 2012. But this exceptionally prosperous period also has perverse effects. As seen here with Brittany Ferries, this level of activity makes the diversification policy of the Nazi constructor, which is essential to avoid excessive dependence on the cruise, more difficult, and thus to guard against a possible reversal of this market. .

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Thanks for that, Jonno. Just a question. Did you use Reverso for the translation as I'm intrigued how they manages to turn St Nazaire (or some version of) into Nazi? If it was Reverso, this article from a week or two back might explain why. 

https://mol.im/a/6760809

Ed

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Thanks Jonno.  So is the thinking now definitely in terms of a direct replacement for Bretagne rather than an indirect one leading to Pont Aven replacing Bretagne?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 minutes ago, Gareth said:

Thanks Jonno.  So is the thinking now definitely in terms of a direct replacement for Bretagne rather than an indirect one leading to Pont Aven replacing Bretagne?

Yes unless they just mean that Bretagne will be the one leaving the fleet hence it being replaced, it will be interesting to see the configuration of the replacement.

  • Thanks 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
23 minutes ago, neilcvx said:

Yes unless they just mean that Bretagne will be the one leaving the fleet hence it being replaced, it will be interesting to see the configuration of the replacement.

The general feeling is that it will be a direct replacement for the reasons discussed on here, to many facilities and cabins on Pont Aven for St Malo full time.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
34 minutes ago, Solo said:

The general feeling is that it will be a direct replacement for the reasons discussed on here, to many facilities and cabins on Pont Aven for St Malo full time.

There’s 2 schools of thought on the subject , it’s never wise to try to second guess BF they are prone to throwing a curve ball every so often.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I agree with that Colin, but was just asking if there was official word on what those plans are going to be when they happen.  From what solo and neil said, it sounds llike there isn’t.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Gareth, I suppose that the plans would be up in the air if post Brexit there may be changes and/or reductions to route structures and traffic levels so not much point in guessing in any detail at this stage although no doubt broad option scenarios will be kept under review.

Who'd be a ferry company at the moment?!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yes I can’t see anything happen until everything regarding Brexit has been finalised and the economic impact has been evaluated, who would like to be running any business that trades or exports to the EU?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Indeed, no point guessing at all.  A futile exercise.  What was posted came across to me as factual information about BF’s plans, so I was just trying to clarify the status of the information.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, Cabin-boy said:

Thanks for that, Jonno. Just a question. Did you use Reverso for the translation as I'm intrigued how they manages to turn St Nazaire (or some version of) into Nazi? If it was Reverso, this article from a week or two back might explain why. 

https://mol.im/a/6760809

Ed

No I just pressed translate in the usual way you do. Interestingly Mer et Marine's English site seems to just be filled with military stuff so I don't look at it that often. I didn't even realised I still had a subscription.

  • Like 1
  • Thanks 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Haven't some been second guessing BF's post Brexit plans since 2016 mostly with comments such as 'oh BF won't do anything until they know'?

Well, we know post referendum they're spending around €180m on Honfleur which requires port investment at Ouistreham this in turn will see traffic increase to Le Havre too and we know the Portsmouth - Spain routes are being specifically expanded... these ships can't dock anywhere else and again PIP requires investment and will see berths 3 & 4 extended further. 

Not exactly standing still and waiting are they?

It's been said more than once now that Bretagne is being replaced with a new build, the most recent reports even says by 2022. For BF to have been actively discussing this with Chantiers and again having been doing this for some time, seems to suggest that the inhouse team at BF towers has already designed her... they're just looking for a yard. 

Why is it so difficult to except?

  • Like 1
  • Sad 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Just had a thought about the partial paint job on Bretagne, if they did a full job now it would need redoing in 2021, by leaving it until her bi-annual docking next year she should go until she leaves the fleet, if everything goes to plan.

  • Sad 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

That does make sense timewise, yes. But why do a partial job now rather than wait? I think Barfleur and MSM will get theirs next time round so she could do the same. Plus why not do NEX at the same time, unless painting on aluminium requires some different equipment or grade of paint? Ed. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Is the replacement for Bretagne being funded by BF unlike Honfluer and unlike the Spanish pair not being chartered? That might explain why BF would delayed a build to secure funding.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I hear that the paint job on Bretagne is a bad bodge, with only some white areas painted, contrasting with stained areas....

  • Like 1
  • Thanks 1
  • Sad 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 minutes ago, colin said:

I hear that the paint job on Bretagne is a bad bodge, with only some white areas painted, contrasting with stained areas....

Yep it looks like that from the photos I can only imagine what it looks like in the flesh.

  • Sad 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
10 hours ago, neilcvx said:

Is the replacement for Bretagne being funded by BF unlike Honfluer and unlike the Spanish pair not being chartered? That might explain why BF would delayed a build to secure funding.

No one has mentioned anything about a build delay... don't know how that conclusion has been jumped to.

BF approached Chantiers to build the ship, they can't, so now BF will move on to another yard. There's a few out there, Stocznia, XSI and the new Rauma yard which has just secured Tallink's Megastar sister could all build the vessel ready for 2022.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, jonno said:

No one has mentioned anything about a build delay... don't know how that conclusion has been jumped to.

BF approached Chantiers to build the ship, they can't, so now BF will move on to another yard. There's a few out there, Stocznia, XSI and the new Rauma yard which has just secured Tallink's Megastar sister could all build the vessel ready for 2022.

I just did , should have said if there was to be a delay , anyway I take it BF are self financing this build, no money from any French regions?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It’s also worth remembering BF wanted Bretagnes replacement to be built and in service by now or in the near future and apparently Pegasis wasn’t built due to funding issues.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Ouest France says the replacement will be longer with more cabins, though, much as I adore m daily rag, their journalistic inaccuracies are legend.... Also say 2018 was a good year financially with best ever loadings on Roscoff-Cork, passenger numbers up overall, but freight down.

This whole Chantiers de l'Atlantique story may have more to do with their PR machine than with BF. No way was this a sudden, final decision to say not possible. No doubt they have been in regular contact, so BF will have long been aware it was extremely unlikely that the ship could be built there.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 hours ago, neilcvx said:

I just did , should have said if there was to be a delay , anyway I take it BF are self financing this build, no money from any French regions?

She'll be funded by the mixed economy owners with BF owning about 25% in a similar way to Pont Aven & Bretagne. BF only own 1% of Armorique.

BF have €450m for fleet renewal, Honfleur is costing around €175m and the E-Flexer charter fees will be ongoing after an initial cash injection. That's the attraction for Stena, a guaranteed stable income whilst enjoying the benefits of amortising their investment.

I'd suggest that there's still somewhere around €200m available which will build you a very nice 170m, 1500 bed, LNG powered cruise ferry.

Have to agree with Colin, the Chantiers de l'Atlantique move could well have been political PR to assuage the unions.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 minutes ago, jonno said:

LNG powered cruise ferry.

If it too is to be LNG-powered then surely all this fuel infrastructure investment should have been done in the UK. They will have refuelling done in Ouistreham, one of the Spanish ports and St Malo. Why not do it in Portsmouth which is the one port all the of the vessels call at every week? Ed. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Sign in to follow this  

×
×
  • Create New...