jonno Posted November 16, 2020 Share Posted November 16, 2020 9 minutes ago, RickOShea said: Fair enough. I can't find any evidence she actually got scrubbers and there are no obvious physical changes so maybe if somebody knows different they can put us right I know from Wartsila's end that initially three emission systems were ordered during Q4 of 2014 and Stena have only advertised two systems being fitted between 2015/'16. The visible evidence, Cotentin's exhaust gases, are very clean. Third party currently waiting for a response from Stena Teknik. Link to post Share on other sites
hf_uk Posted November 16, 2020 Share Posted November 16, 2020 29 minutes ago, RickOShea said: Fair enough. I can't find any evidence she actually got scrubbers and there are no obvious physical changes so maybe if somebody knows different they can put us right So potentially then, if not, she would have to burn diesel, like Bretagne? Could be expensive and hamper any attempt to make a route such as Cherbourg/Le Havre profitable, with a very low passenger capacity? Link to post Share on other sites
hf_uk Posted November 16, 2020 Share Posted November 16, 2020 Presumably, Pelican has scrubbers? Link to post Share on other sites
Cabin-boy Posted November 16, 2020 Share Posted November 16, 2020 30 minutes ago, IanN said: I wonder if LHCity knows where they could finds some around the dock area They'll be on strike! Ed. Link to post Share on other sites
RickOShea Posted November 16, 2020 Share Posted November 16, 2020 1 hour ago, hf_uk said: Presumably, Pelican has scrubbers? Yes - they were installed last Autumn. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
colinschandler Posted November 16, 2020 Share Posted November 16, 2020 1 hour ago, Cabin-boy said: They'll be on strike! Ed. Difficult to ply their trade with social distancing. Mind you some S&M kit could qualify as PPE - or so I am told. 2 Link to post Share on other sites
LHCity Posted November 16, 2020 Share Posted November 16, 2020 According to official information, ETRETAT will make Le Havre / Portsmouth from January to April and COTENTIN will take over from April to June. 2 Link to post Share on other sites
Danim24 Posted November 16, 2020 Share Posted November 16, 2020 (edited) 9 minutes ago, LHCity said: According to official information, ETRETAT will make Le Havre / Portsmouth from January to April and COTENTIN will take over from April to June. So, Cotentin will do Cherbourg/Poole from Jan - end March, then Le Havre/Portsmouth. Why only until June? Edited November 16, 2020 by Danim24 missing text. Link to post Share on other sites
Rattler43 Posted November 16, 2020 Share Posted November 16, 2020 6 minutes ago, Danim24 said: So, Cotentin will do Cherbourg/Poole from Jan - end March, then Le Havre/Portsmouth. Why only until June? End of UK government subsidy perhaps? 1 Link to post Share on other sites
LHCity Posted November 16, 2020 Share Posted November 16, 2020 15 minutes ago, Danim24 said: So, Cotentin will do Cherbourg/Poole from Jan - end March, then Le Havre/Portsmouth. Why only until June? A lot can happen between now and June. Cotentin could continue, perhaps in duet with Normandie Express if the demand justifies it ... and later there is Cap Finistère, whose future assignment is still not known. Brittany Ferries may also be waiting to see how Brexit will go, including port saturation. Managing truck queues in Ouistreham may raise questions... 2 Link to post Share on other sites
RickOShea Posted November 16, 2020 Share Posted November 16, 2020 Further to @LHCity's post, it has also been announced that ETRETAT is being handed back to Stena RoRo. Link to post Share on other sites
David Williams Posted November 16, 2020 Share Posted November 16, 2020 (edited) 13 minutes ago, LHCity said: and later there is Cap Finistère, whose future assignment is still not known CF is back on the Portsmouth - Bilbao route from the end of March, note that Barfleur is due to restart on the 23 March. At present the timetables assume that all routes (apart from NEX and Le Havre) restart before Easter, they do not currently include the Brexit specials. Edited November 16, 2020 by David Williams Link to post Share on other sites
LHCity Posted November 16, 2020 Share Posted November 16, 2020 4 minutes ago, David Williams said: CF is back on the Portsmouth - Bilbao route from the end of March, note that Barfleur is due to restart on the 23 March. At present the timetables assume that all routes (apart from NEX and Le Havre) restart before Easter, they do not currently include the Brexit specials. There is something brewing between Le Havre and Rosslare that could affect le Havre's schedules in Portsmouth... nothing is fixed yet Link to post Share on other sites
The Ferry Man Posted November 16, 2020 Share Posted November 16, 2020 43 minutes ago, LHCity said: According to official information, ETRETAT will make Le Havre / Portsmouth from January to April and COTENTIN will take over from April to June. 18 minutes ago, RickOShea said: Further to @LHCity's post, it has also been announced that ETRETAT is being handed back to Stena RoRo. I was spot on then! Now... i wonder what this weeks lottery numbers are! 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites
RickOShea Posted November 16, 2020 Share Posted November 16, 2020 4 hours ago, jonno said: I know from Wartsila's end that initially three emission systems were ordered during Q4 of 2014 and Stena have only advertised two systems being fitted between 2015/'16. The visible evidence, Cotentin's exhaust gases, are very clean. Third party currently waiting for a response from Stena Teknik. I have managed to check with Official BF sources - COTENTIN doesn't have scrubbers and there are no plans to install them. 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites
jonno Posted November 17, 2020 Share Posted November 17, 2020 2 hours ago, RickOShea said: I have managed to check with Official BF sources - COTENTIN doesn't have scrubbers and there are no plans to install them. Good enough for me. Makes me more curious as to which vessel received the third system bought from Wartsila. Link to post Share on other sites
Fine Whine Posted November 17, 2020 Share Posted November 17, 2020 13 hours ago, hf_uk said: So potentially then, if not, she would have to burn diesel, like Bretagne? Could be expensive and hamper any attempt to make a route such as Cherbourg/Le Havre profitable, with a very low passenger capacity? Assuming she will be running in freight mode only then they will do what Armorique is currently operating at Ouistreham, which is taking 30 minutes longer to do the crossing than MSM now or Normandie next month. 6h15 minutes against 5h45 doesn’t sound a great deal but I imagine the fuel saving will be huge even when burning marine diesel. Despite the insistence by some on here that the 2 ex P&O sisters should somehow be resurrected, that I’m afraid is complete lunacy. They had to do the crossing in 5h30 minutes because of the inability to turn round in under 2 hours due to single deck loading, racked up huge fuel bills in the process and operated with more than double the crew numbers Cotentin or a Visentini requires. Nice ships yes, but totally wrong for the route and heavily loss making as passenger traffic evolved. Chris Link to post Share on other sites
jonno Posted November 17, 2020 Share Posted November 17, 2020 14 hours ago, hf_uk said: So potentially then, if not, she would have to burn diesel, like Bretagne? Could be expensive and hamper any attempt to make a route such as Cherbourg/Le Havre profitable, with a very low passenger capacity? The fuel is a third of the price it was back in 2014, HFO in 2014 was actually more expensive than MDO is today. Russian oil is $39 a barrel compared to the $150 price 6 years ago. They produce more now than ever did as the Soviet Union. OPEC no longer has the grip it did keeping prices high in a similar way to the diamond miners who keep 1000's of tonnes off the market in order to keep the price of the cheapest and most common gem stone high. I'd also assume that they'll pay the HMG VAT flat rate of 10% Link to post Share on other sites
RickOShea Posted November 17, 2020 Share Posted November 17, 2020 8 hours ago, jonno said: Good enough for me. Makes me more curious as to which vessel received the third system bought from Wartsila. I must confess my interest areas are primarily operational and commercial, technical stuff I tend to only be interested in headlines and "need to know". However a glance at my archive shows Stena did try a variety of different scrubber technologies such as CROE on STENA FORERUNNER and AEC on STENA SCOTIA (not a success). Link to post Share on other sites
RickOShea Posted November 17, 2020 Share Posted November 17, 2020 1 hour ago, jonno said: The fuel is a third of the price it was back in 2014, HFO in 2014 was actually more expensive than MDO is today. Russian oil is $39 a barrel compared to the $150 price 6 years ago. They produce more now than ever did as the Soviet Union. OPEC no longer has the grip it did keeping prices high in a similar way to the diamond miners who keep 1000's of tonnes off the market in order to keep the price of the cheapest and most common gem stone high. I'd also assume that they'll pay the HMG VAT flat rate of 10% Back in the period 2013/2014 there was a total panic in the industry about SECA coming in and every firm tried to make an educated decision on the best way forward. In reality my feeling is that a firm such as P&O Ferries made the right call (even if I'd venture that it probably wasn't for the right reasons). Given where oil prices went, had they installed scrubbers on vessels like the PRIDE OF KENT/CANTERBURY/BURGUNDY they'd never have got the return on investment from burning cheaper fuel Vs cost of scrubber installation. Oh to see the future! 1 Link to post Share on other sites
jonno Posted November 17, 2020 Share Posted November 17, 2020 (edited) 59 minutes ago, RickOShea said: Back in the period 2013/2014 there was a total panic in the industry about SECA coming in and every firm tried to make an educated decision on the best way forward. In reality my feeling is that a firm such as P&O Ferries made the right call (even if I'd venture that it probably wasn't for the right reasons). Given where oil prices went, had they installed scrubbers on vessels like the PRIDE OF KENT/CANTERBURY/BURGUNDY they'd never have got the return on investment from burning cheaper fuel Vs cost of scrubber installation. Oh to see the future! One thing, Pride of Kent had an open loop system fitted way back in 2005, she was a test bed case in a similar way to Ficaria Seaways whose Alfa Laval system was a great success but was tempered by the huge cost and it was an aesthetic anomaly making what Pont Aven has bolted to her roof akin to the Mona Lisa. The panic was solely created by the operators themselves. The regulation was signed way back in 1999 at the same time as the emission tier system was set out. Testing and cost analysis had been conducted for a decade prior to the IMO ruling coming into force. The Klimt- Mollenbach study of a 38,000 DWT tanker in 2012, three years before the ruling would be implemented and during a time of high fuel prices, concluded that the financial return using scrubbers is wholly dependant on the price of HFO. The study indicated that the most favourable economic outcome was to burn MGO. Life cycle for both open and closed loop systems is 5 -10 years, on a new build such as Galicia that's a minimum of 3 -4 replacement systems during the service life of the vessel costing millions. As of now open loop systems can only be used in open waters, wash water cannot be discharged within 12 miles of any port and the minimal tidal flow in the the Med and the Baltic means the alkalinity will be seriously effected with long term use. *Marpol Annex VI was added to the amendment protocol in 1997. Edited November 17, 2020 by jonno Link to post Share on other sites
Khaines Posted November 29, 2020 Share Posted November 29, 2020 Marine Traffic now shows now as Cotentin. 2 Link to post Share on other sites
Gareth Posted November 29, 2020 Share Posted November 29, 2020 You’ll also find Jim had added her to the BF fleet tracker. The wanderer returns! 2 Link to post Share on other sites
The Ferry Man Posted November 29, 2020 Share Posted November 29, 2020 Is this the longest a BF vessel has been chartered out to another company? Certainly beats Barfleur Link to post Share on other sites
Khaines Posted November 29, 2020 Share Posted November 29, 2020 2 hours ago, The Ferry Man said: Is this the longest a BF vessel has been chartered out to another company? Certainly beats Barfleur How many returns has Barfleur had, This will be her third return to Poole won’t it after lay ups/charter? She has been up and down that canal...😄 2 Link to post Share on other sites
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