Jump to content
Message added by Jim,

Please remember - this thread can get a bit heated at times... try to keep politics out of it, and be respectful to the views of others.

Recommended Posts

1 hour ago, jonno said:

In many ways ignorance can be bliss.

The trouble these days is the opposite, we are bombarded with information and we have to decide what bits to believe or trust and not everyone believes the same bits.

  • Like 2
Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Replies 3.2k
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

Top Posters In This Topic

Popular Posts

We've a young crowd in here today!

It will be pasta and rice next, how have they got through the stockpiles from March?

Neil’s photo reminded me of my own mother, also a Margaret and 88 years young, lives on her own in a retirement flat near Bristol. She hasn’t seen anyone for over a week now so really important point

Posted Images

Quote

I assume that next week he'll be telling mummy not to kiss Santa Clause under the mistletoe as he's not part of the support bubble. 

Santa is a Super Spreader - all that foreign travel (sorry 😏)

  • Like 1
  • Haha 2
Link to post
Share on other sites
13 minutes ago, Solo said:

The trouble these days is the opposite, we are bombarded with information and we have to decide what bits to believe or trust and not everyone believes the same bits.

Most of it is an opinion stated as a fact to support a personal view or agenda and will change when that personal view or agenda changes and will then become a new fact.

For example opinion masks have little if any effect becomes a fact supported by the government at the start of the pandemic. Later opinion changed to masks are beneficial which again becomes a fact supported by the government. (I believe masks are beneficial). I suspect that this "fact" changed for two reasons 

1) Masks became available

2) The government needed to be seen to do something and masks were a no cost option to them. Or can you get them on prescription.

So we need to decide for ourselves and in any activity we take reduce the risks to others as much as we possibly can. 

  • Like 2
Link to post
Share on other sites
5 hours ago, Khaines said:

hese bleating kids don’t know how lucky they are

Lucky?

Out of work with no money and with a very bleak future!!!

It will be interesting to know how many school leavers and graduates this year have got a job 

Those who have a jobs are going to be paying off the debt as well our social security, pensions  etc. for the rest of their lives This will also include all of our grandchildren. Give them a break some are idiots and uncaring but I suspect most do have a social conscience

  • Like 6
Link to post
Share on other sites

"Marseille fury at Paris decree to shut its bars as coronavirus soars" - new restrictions in France:

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/sep/24/marseille-fury-at-paris-decree-to-shut-its-bars-as-coronavirus-soars

Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Cabin-boy said:

According to the BBC website, Matt Hancock has not ruled out the option of telling students not to go home at Christmas to avoid the virus spreading among families. The last time he told students not to do something (attend parties/fresher's week etc) they didn't seem to take a blind bit of notice but presumably something has now changed.

 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-54268780

It was interesting listening to the phone in on Radio Scotland this morning. A couple of people called in who have offspring in the halls in Murano Street and who are having to self-isolate. Despite what the university is saying, one claimed that his daughter, who has tested positive, is not being supplied with food; how long will students stay in isolation if that is the case? A local resident also called in and said during freshers week the students were partying and making a general nuisance of themselves in the street with no social distancing.

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, cvabishop said:

Very true if there is nothing you can practicallyy do about it but if it is possible to mitigate the situation and you don't then it can be costly.

The problem we have now is balancing the mitigation between health and the economy and there is no general consensus as to where that lies.

In 2018 26,500 died in England of flu. Excess winter deaths in Wales doubled that year too. The consensus clearly shows that as a mortality rate for an infection which has a vaccine this is exceptable. 90% were of pensionable age.

I don't remember it being a topic on on BFE or splashed as a headline across the tabloids... It's still more of a threat to the vulnerable and our older population than Covid and, so far,  has a greater mortality rate during 2020 in the 70-90 age groups.

In the same year there were 1.2 million hospital admissions due to alcohol related disease, not weekend headbangers or bingers, chronic disease. Should we quarantine the pubs and wine & spirits aisles in the supermarket or have the police use drones to keep an eye on the populations consumption?

It's more of a burden and use of bed space in the NHS than Covid will ever be.

But again, it's not on the news or in the papers and there's no press conferences so it's not important.

 

 

  • Like 3
Link to post
Share on other sites
51 minutes ago, jonno said:

 

 

Should we quarantine the pubs and wine & spirits aisles in the supermarket or have the police use drones to keep an eye on the populations consumption?

 

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/868898/2020_Jan_UK_Alc_Stat_Comm.pdf

Could the £14 billion received by the exchequer in excise duty in the last financial year be the reason why this would be unlikely to happen?

Edited by colinschandler
grammar
Link to post
Share on other sites
19 hours ago, cvabishop said:

The foreign holiday hordes have indulged their desperate need to escape the UK for the sunshine, mingling with like minded people from across the UK at the airport and sharing their exhalations on the flight out.

Although air travel is a major vector in the spread of biological agents, for context on how much flying has shrunk in 2020 and become a minor factor in the spread, below is a table of how air travel has changed between 2019 - 2020 (figures CAA). Number of passengers by month and year. 

 

2019

2020

% of 2019

January

19,251,805

19,262,665

0.06

February

19,131,772

18,783,599

-1.82

March

22,304,700

10,056,527

-54.91

April

24,690,108

334,635

-98.64

May

26,794,086

384,693

-98.56

June

28,558,545

698,296

-97.55

July

30,309,005

3,521,634

-88.38

August

30,870,626

5,214,992

-83.11

In August 2020 720,604 were UK routes (-81%), 3,442,743 EU (-83%) and the rest International (-88). 

Maybe puts context on BFs 74/75% drop too.

Also airports are going above and beyond not to be associated with spread. Planes, airports and even the transit around the airports are being disinfected constantly. A couple of videos

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZWhixGjPQAY - includes the person disinfection module. 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1xSxbEqzohI

These are from the beginning of lockdown, aviation started early as it knew they would get the blame.

Even now airports like Heathrow are installing escalator handrail disinfectors which clean the handrail as it is used. Coming to an escalator near you soon.

 

  • Thanks 1
Link to post
Share on other sites

There was a suggestion that the way to resume safe travel is to develop and use rapid tests which could be administered to travellers before they fly/embark with results back within an hour. You could then be reasonably sure that your aircraft/ship would be Covid free. Obviously it would be needed in both directions of travel.

However I gather that the technology isn't yet there for reliable tests and there could be other issues. Has anyone any further information on this?

Link to post
Share on other sites
9 minutes ago, cvabishop said:

However I gather that the technology isn't yet there for reliable tests and there could be other issues. Has anyone any further information on this?

This is from the BBC today:

----

A US airline is to become the first in the world to offer rapid coronavirus testing to passengers.

Travellers flying with United Airlines from San Francisco to Hawaii from 15 October will be able to take a test that offers results within 15 minutes. Alternatively, they can opt to receive a test via post that they will need to return within 72 hours of flying.

The airline said that Hawaiian officials had agreed that any passenger who tested negative on either test would be exempt from the state's 14-day quarantine period.

Earlier this week, a body representing the aviation industry called for rapid testing to encourage people to start flying again.

"This will give governments the confidence to open their borders without complicated risk models that see constant changes in the rules imposed on travel," the head of the International Air Transport Association said on Tuesday, noting that air travel has been down 92% on last year's figures.

----

Ed

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites
10 hours ago, Khaines said:

Nowadays, so many of todays younger age groups take for granted their freedoms and have no idea of what it is like to have their freedoms curtailed.  Their answer is to carry on doing as they like or join protest groups opposed to what they are being asked to do.  In the days of the wars they would not have dared.

To be fair, only the fairly elderly have ever lived through war or similar restrictions and this isn't a war.

I see people of all ages that are questioning the government on this and going against the rules. That's maybe not surprising when the path through this is such a balancing act (ignoring the hash our own government is making of issuing clear guidance and winning trust). 

It's not helpful or correct, in my opinion to divide people like this. Especially not when we are being asked to carry on with education, work and economic activities like eating out - the burden of the first two items falling disproportionately heavily on younger generations.

  • Like 2
Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, VikingVoyager said:

They are sailing from there currently. Departures are irregular but there are two more planned soon...

It’s one of their “one way” routes.  Like Roscoff-Bilbao.

  • Haha 2
Link to post
Share on other sites
8 hours ago, cvabishop said:

The current upsurge of infections in Europe correlates with the easing of restrictions which, among other things, enabled hundreds of thousands, if not millions, of holiday makers to criss cross Europe over the last couple of months or so.

Doesn't it also corelate with the easing of restrictions here and encouragement to socialise that enabled the entire country to mix far more freely than it had been previously?

Link to post
Share on other sites

The issue with any test is that is only correct at the moment of the test. You may have SARS-CoV-2 in your system but early stage so may not register on the test, so does not mean you are clean.

COVID test are not a definite either, the process used is for screening before getting a proper diagnosis. PCR testing only indicates if a genetic strand (a small part of the DNA) of the virus , it does mean the virus is complete, active or infectious. This means all the positive tests may not be infectious COVID. Any test is any indication only.

PHE - "It is important to note that detecting viral material by PCR does not indicate that the virus is fully intact and infectious, i.e. able to cause infection in other people. The isolation of infectious virus from positive individuals requires culture methods conducted in laboratories with specialist containment facilities and are time consuming and complex" 

The more I look at testing, the more I wonder why for pillar 2?

Full blown COVID hits you like an express train, you don't need to test to know.
Asymptomatic people are not going to get tested as they don't know.
The DGASers are not getting tested just in case and curtails life.
Ditto mild cases depending on ethical persuasion.

COVID tests have become the defacto sticking plaster so the masses / companies can tick a box and feel happy or not about life.

We need simple rules - Feeling the COVID tingle, don't mingle.

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites
7 hours ago, IanN said:

Lucky?

Out of work with no money and with a very bleak future!!!

It will be interesting to know how many school leavers and graduates this year have got a job 

Those who have a jobs are going to be paying off the debt as well our social security, pensions  etc. for the rest of their lives This will also include all of our grandchildren. Give them a break some are idiots and uncaring but I suspect most do have a social conscience

This.

I appreciate that some of you may not feel the same way, but I genuinely feel sorry for some of the students where they are in lockdown.

Starting Uni is an extremely difficult time for some. I know, I was so homesick, I almost quit Uni and I don't know whether I would have got to where I am today without having gone through Uni. Those first few weeks were so, so tough. Ironically I felt most comfortable when I was in my own company, because that way it felt like nothing had changed. But the two key things that kept me going were 1) being able to meet up with another coursemate (we had a mutual friend from back home) who was in the same boat and had the same feeling (we joked that we got eachother through that first term) and 2) going home every fortnight.

The students in local lockdown in their halls don't have that. And the people you share a flat/floor with in first year are just random people you are put together with; they may not have anything in common. Indeed whilst my floor weren't bad, they definitely weren't my people and we just lived side by side but without much interaction after a good few months. 

It would have been so easy to be tipped over the edge but I was lucky that what we now consider 'freedoms' of 10 years ago meant I stuck in there and am better for it. Some of those may not be so lucky.

 

  • Like 6
Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, AdamW said:

And the people you share a flat/floor with in first year are just random people you are put together with; they may not have anything in common. Indeed whilst my floor weren't bad, they definitely weren't my people and we just lived side by side but without much interaction after a good few months. 

 

I believe that universities were trying to put students in accommodation with others on the same course in an effort to create bubbles. That might mean that students have something in common with those living around them. 

My student daughter is in 3rd year and like many from Central Scotland lives at home; that scenario has its own issues. Her lecturers were on strike at the start of 2020 and classes had just begun to return to normal when lockdown happened. She has been able to keep in touch with uni friends via social media and Zoom but last night had to leave a Zoom meeting when it all got too much for her as she realised how much she is missing out on face to face interaction with her peers. 

Link to post
Share on other sites
8 hours ago, colinschandler said:

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/868898/2020_Jan_UK_Alc_Stat_Comm.pdf

Could the £14 billion received by the exchequer in excise duty in the last financial year be the reason why this would be unlikely to happen?

Yep... shame it costs £75 billion annually to treat them.

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites
11 hours ago, Cabin-boy said:

This is from the BBC today:

----

A US airline is to become the first in the world to offer rapid coronavirus testing to passengers.

Travellers flying with United Airlines from San Francisco to Hawaii from 15 October will be able to take a test that offers results within 15 minutes. Alternatively, they can opt to receive a test via post that they will need to return within 72 hours of flying.

The airline said that Hawaiian officials had agreed that any passenger who tested negative on either test would be exempt from the state's 14-day quarantine period.

Earlier this week, a body representing the aviation industry called for rapid testing to encourage people to start flying again.

"This will give governments the confidence to open their borders without complicated risk models that see constant changes in the rules imposed on travel," the head of the International Air Transport Association said on Tuesday, noting that air travel has been down 92% on last year's figures.

----

Ed

And sniffer-dogs.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-54288067

Ed

Link to post
Share on other sites
On 23/09/2020 at 21:14, cvabishop said:

So, let’s see where we are then.

 

The foreign holiday hordes have indulged their desperate need to escape the UK for the sunshine, mingling with like minded people from across the UK at the airport and sharing their exhalations on the flight out. During their ‘well earned’ break they have got up close and personal with their compatriots from the UK and probably with foreign nationals who have contributed their own versions of Covid to the general mix. On the homeward flight they have again shared their breathing with fellow passengers from all over the UK and again when queuing to get off the plane and proceed through immigration.

 

Once home they have shared their wonderful holiday experiences (and perhaps the virus) with their mates at raves and house parties plus of course their families in several households.

 

And now? Oh gosh, the Covid transmission rates are increasing exponentially.

 

Is it really a surprise?

 

Please change the record Colin. 

Link to post
Share on other sites

×
×
  • Create New...