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2 hours ago, neilcvx said:

I looked at getting the Eurostar from up here in Scotland it was just so time consuming and expensive when you factor in the train from Edinburgh/Newcastle/Berwick and the connecting London train to st Pancreas so I suppose it depends how many people don’t want to travel to London first and have driving/cycling holidays etc.

Not sure you can get a connecting train between Kings Cross and St. Pancras, it's only a few minutes walk.

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2 hours ago, neilcvx said:

I looked at getting the Eurostar from up here in Scotland it was just so time consuming and expensive when you factor in the train from Edinburgh/Newcastle/Berwick and the connecting London train to st Pancreas so I suppose it depends how many people don’t want to travel to London first and have driving/cycling holidays etc.

If you have a two together railcard the train fare from Harrogate-York- Kings Cross isn't too bad. We're travelling to London for a Royal College thing on the 13th April getting in at 1900 travelling back the Sunday teatime. Through Trainline it's £65.50 1st class return.

You're right though Neil, I looked at Eurostar and the cheapest return fare I could find to Amsterdam at a realistic time was £160. Add the probable London overnighter at the nearest Premier Inn-Euston Road is a 5 min walk, plus another hotel in Holland and you're easily looking a £500 even before you've bought your first Oranjeboom.

For that you could fly to Stockholm and do Viking Grace... Far more satisfying.

 

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14 hours ago, jonno said:

I see that Eurostar are to start a direct route from London to Amsterdam in April taking 3 hrs 41 minutes. It's via Brussels on the return until the UK have negotiated passport checks in the Netherlands.

I wonder what effect this will have on sailings, particularly DFDS especially as Centraal Station is where their coaches drop passengers from the port.

I expect this new service will also be of concern to Stena Line, especially as they have been marketing their 'Dutch flyer' rail/sail packages from Liverpool street for some years now. 

Still, we are certainly well catered for in terms of options for visiting the Netherlands, and that can't be a bad thing ;)

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11 minutes ago, Ryan_H said:

I expect this new service will also be of concern to Stena Line, especially as they have been marketing their 'Dutch flyer' rail/sail packages from Liverpool street for some years now. 

Still, we are certainly well catered for in terms of options for visiting the Netherlands, and that can't be a bad thing ;)

I would think with Harwichs proximity to London compared to Newcastle it would be more of a concern to Stena although it would probably be mostly foot passengers  they would suffer loses from .

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I would suspect that Eurostar are not really targeting the same market as Stena but any extra competition on the route has to be good for consumers, both in terms of pricing and offers and the level of service provided. Let's hope it's a success and they are able to offer other routes in the future, to Geneva or Frankfurt perhaps or maybe even Berlin if the infrastructure is compatible. Ed. 

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I didn't include either Stena or P&O as the Hoek of Holland & Rotterdam are both well over an hour away from Amsterdam centre, it's why DFDS are more popular with those wanting a jolly in the Capitol.

Ed, the rail network can support a Eurostar train to all of Germany's major cities, even Switzerland & Italy. The problems are time & cost. The Thalys from Brussels takes nearly 7 hours to Berlin and they are the same trains. That would be nearly 10 hours from St Pancras.

I can see a future London-Cologne service, 4 hours is far more attractive... a couple of episodes of Endeavour on your laptop and Bob's your uncle..

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17 minutes ago, jonno said:

The problems are time & cost. The Thalys from Brussels takes nearly 7 hours to Berlin and they are the same trains. That would be nearly 10 hours from St Pancras

Yes. That's what I meant about the infrastructure. If the trains can't travel at full speed then there is no point in offering the service. Cologne makes sense, particularly as the exhibition centre there is, I believe, often host to important shows and trade fairs. Geneva should be possible in around 5 or 6 hours from London I guess but that might not be worthwhile given the short flight time between the two cities. Ed. 

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1 hour ago, Danish Ferry Person said:

Think DFDS should be more worried about Eurostar. Stena's service is more of a practice car ferry, where DFDS' appeals to foot passengers much more than Stena's. Although, car passengers go on DFDS, and foot passengers go on Stena, I am just pointing out the majority target markets of each. 

Stena runs from train-connected ports at either end with dedicated boat trains in the UK and foot passengers sailing for transport remain a decent market for them. DFDS on the other hand run from ports requiring bus connections. If you really mean that Stena don't do much of the mini cruise market whereas DFDS do that's true.

Linking these two operations together however is somewhat misleading - there aren't too many people travelling without a car who will evaluate Harwich vs North Shields and decide on the latter because they sail nearer to Amsterdam. IJmuiden is an hour's bus ride away whereas HVH is nearer two hours by train (or bus+train at the moment). Much more of a factor is where they start in the UK - unless you're somewhere in say Yorkshire or Lancashire one or the other is going to be materially easier. And us inbetweenies might just as well use P&O at Hull.

Edited by hhvferry
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The timings are an important factor when looking at the Eurostar service.  The trains will leave St Pancras at 0831 and 1731.  The first will mean a very early start even for people living in the London area, or a night in a hotel in London.  The second service is too early for anyone spending a working day in London, but still gives a late evening arrival in Amsterdam.  Neither offers much advantage over the overnight service from Harwich to Hoek van Holland, leaving London at 1730 and getting to Amsterdam at 1030.

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3 hours ago, GeoffHamer said:

The timings are an important factor when looking at the Eurostar service.  The trains will leave St Pancras at 0831 and 1731.  The first will mean a very early start even for people living in the London area, or a night in a hotel in London.  The second service is too early for anyone spending a working day in London, but still gives a late evening arrival in Amsterdam.  Neither offers much advantage over the overnight service from Harwich to Hoek van Holland, leaving London at 1730 and getting to Amsterdam at 1030.

I thought there were more frequent services on the Eurostar... Perhaps if frequency was beefed up a little, it should look like: 

--06:00 

-09:30

-15:00

-18:30

Would rather get the train, than the ferry personally, but either way is a good option.

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On 09/02/2018 at 23:26, neilcvx said:

The high possibility of getting lost then 😉

It would be rather difficult to get lost.... the stations are next to each other, only the road to cross ;-)

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18 minutes ago, LD said:

It would be rather difficult to get lost.... the stations are next to each other, only the road to cross ;-)

Probably something I will never need to know but cheers apparently it’s Euston the East coast main line comes into which shows my navigation skills 😉

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33 minutes ago, neilcvx said:

Probably something I will never need to know but cheers apparently it’s Euston the East coast main line comes into which shows my navigation skills 😉

Euston is the London terminus for the West Coast main line.  The East Coast routes into Kings Cross.

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31 minutes ago, neilcvx said:

Probably something I will never need to know but cheers apparently it’s Euston the East coast main line comes into which shows my navigation skills 😉

No you were right Neil It's Kings Cross.

I originally remembered the London stations like my right hand... Thumb was Paddington & Victoria, 3 fingers for Marylebone, Euston, Kings Cross/St Pancras and my little finger for Liverpool St.

Don't ask what I used for Waterloo & Charing Cross!

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11 minutes ago, Cabin-boy said:

But are they aerodynamic and hydrodynamic? Are why are they equipped with a death-slide which takes any adventurous user directly into the waiting blades of a helicopter? Ed

Well they have a nice rounded front, and I believe the flat stem is for improved seakeeping. I have always wondered how much it impoves fuel efficency by reducing the Froude number due t the extra metres due to lack of keel rake

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  • Gareth changed the title to DFDS Updates

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